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Carbon monoxide poisoning from 3D laser printer may have killed Berkeley couple

sanfrancisco.cbslocal.com

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Re: Carbon monoxide poisoning from 3D laser printer may have killed Berkeley couple

#11

Post by chris_st »

oasisbob wrote: post #5
tbenst wrote: post #3

Unclear what a "laser 3D printer" means--possibly selective laser sintering, but that doesn't produce carbon monoxide to my knowledge. Possibly a homegrown machine. Tragic reminder of the importance of proper workspaces.

Glowforge marketed their laser cutter as a 3D laser printer, didn't they? As someone waiting for their Glowforge to ship, I really hope their device wasn't involved in all this.

From Glowforge's website, for their base model:

> It needs ventilation via the provided 4″ diameter (10.2cm) hose. We recommend putting the hose out a window.

Re: Carbon monoxide poisoning from 3D laser printer may have killed Berkeley couple

#13

Post by anigbrowl »

digi_owl wrote: post #8
mbgaxyz wrote: post #2

Related: "According to a study completed by a team at the Illinois Institute of Technology, typical desktop 3D printers emit particles and compounds during printing that federal agencies say could cause cancer or other ailments." http://www.chicagotribune.com/bluesky/originals/ct-3d-printe...

At this point living seems to cause cancer...

That's an especially asinine comment given the clear cause and effect on display in this case.

Re: Carbon monoxide poisoning from 3D laser printer may have killed Berkeley couple

#14

Post by adammunich »

dekhn wrote: post #6
lima wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Might be a laser cutter/engraver. Would make more sense since those actually do burn the material.

I don't know anything specific in this case (I have been following it since it was first reported, since it's local, and mysterious). But my first suspicion would be the CO2 gas supply to the laser. Low-quality CO2 gas has CO impurities. I think a leak in the gas supply, combined with really poor ventilation, could possibly lead to this situation, but I'm still surprised there would be enough CO to fatally poison 2 p…

Co2 lasers are 30℅ CO by design. Kind of like a halogen cycle thing but recombinant.

There is very little gas in a tube though.

Re: Carbon monoxide poisoning from 3D laser printer may have killed Berkeley couple

#15

Post by abalone »

Tragic. Recently California started requiring carbon monoxide detectors in most homes.[1] Make sure you have one.

That's a surprising cause though. How much CO can a laser printer/cutter produce, worst case?

[1] http://www.ci.berkeley.ca.us/Planning_and_Development/Housin...

Re: Carbon monoxide poisoning from 3D laser printer may have killed Berkeley couple

#16

Post by stcredzero »

dekhn wrote: post #6
lima wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Might be a laser cutter/engraver. Would make more sense since those actually do burn the material.

I don't know anything specific in this case (I have been following it since it was first reported, since it's local, and mysterious). But my first suspicion would be the CO2 gas supply to the laser. Low-quality CO2 gas has CO impurities. I think a leak in the gas supply, combined with really poor ventilation, could possibly lead to this situation, but I'm still surprised there would be enough CO to fatally poison 2 p…

CO poisoning is cumulative. It takes a long time for CO to get unstuck from hemoglobin. It could have snuck up on them slowly, then one evening with the cats "napping" they felt particularly tired and thought to themselves, "We must be in hibernation mode from the chilly weather," then they went to sleep then never woke up.

CO is odorless. You might get a headache, or you might only feel tired. What's worse: a lot of CO detectors are pretty shoddy.

Re: Carbon monoxide poisoning from 3D laser printer may have killed Berkeley couple

#17

Post by anigbrowl »

chris_st wrote: post #11
oasisbob wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Glowforge marketed their laser cutter as a 3D laser printer, didn't they? As someone waiting for their Glowforge to ship, I really hope their device wasn't involved in all this.

From Glowforge's website, for their base model: > It needs ventilation via the provided 4″ diameter (10.2cm) hose. We recommend putting the hose out a window.

I'm guessing this is undergoing a hurried rewrite, to add something along the lines of 'or you may die.' they're gonna get sued out the yin-yang for this even if the dead couple totally ignored the instructions, on the grounds that the instructions didn't state the danger clearly enough.

Having said that, while good safety information is important, two MIT-trained engineers should really have known better.

Re: Carbon monoxide poisoning from 3D laser printer may have killed Berkeley couple

#18

Post by stcredzero »

CO poisoning is cumulative. It takes a long time for CO to get unstuck from hemoglobin. (About 2 weeks, IIRC.) It could have snuck up on them slowly, then one evening with the cats "napping" they felt particularly tired and thought to themselves, "We must be in hibernation mode from the chilly weather," then they went to sleep then never woke up.

CO is odorless. You might get a headache, or you might only feel tired. What's worse: a lot of cheap CO detectors are pretty shoddy.

Re: Carbon monoxide poisoning from 3D laser printer may have killed Berkeley couple

#19

Post by sokoloff »

adammunich wrote: post #14
dekhn wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know anything specific in this case (I have been following it since it was first reported, since it's local, and mysterious). But my first suspicion would be the CO2 gas supply to the laser. Low-quality CO2 gas has CO impurities. I think a leak in the gas supply, combined with really poor ventilation, could possibly lead to this situation, but I'm still surprised there would be enough CO to fatally poison 2 p…

Co2 lasers are 30℅ CO by design. Kind of like a halogen cycle thing but recombinant. There is very little gas in a tube though.

It seems the poisoning came from the operation of the laser, which means that the gases inside the laser were not involved. (It doesn't seem from breakage of the tube, but from usage.)

Re: Carbon monoxide poisoning from 3D laser printer may have killed Berkeley couple

#20

Post by xiphmont »

dekhn wrote: post #6
lima wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Might be a laser cutter/engraver. Would make more sense since those actually do burn the material.

I don't know anything specific in this case (I have been following it since it was first reported, since it's local, and mysterious). But my first suspicion would be the CO2 gas supply to the laser. Low-quality CO2 gas has CO impurities. I think a leak in the gas supply, combined with really poor ventilation, could possibly lead to this situation, but I'm still surprised there would be enough CO to fatally poison 2 p…

The CO2 laser tubes sold to hobbyists are sealed. There is no gas supply. Large industrial lasers use a gas supply in order to cut faster and at higher power.

Some home-built tubes do use a gas supply, but virtually no one builds their own CO2 tube to use in a laser cutter when better tubes are available on eBay for $100.

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