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First they came for the Iranians

scottaaronson.com

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Re: First they came for the Iranians

#31

Post by danso »

guard-of-terra wrote: post #28
threeseed wrote: post #14

Such a cynical yet poorly thought out policy. Firstly, many people involved in terrorist incidents are natural born citizens of allied countries. So are we going to ban all French or Belgium citizens given they have been shown to harbor terrorists ? It's clear that Trump/Bannon desperately want a Muslim ban as opposed to a Iran/Iraq/etc ban. Secondly, this is going to alienate moderate Muslims who Western intelligenc…

If you has Muslims in your country, then yes you might need to work with moderate Muslims in order to be suppressing problem of radicalization. Not sure how well it works tho. But if you do not have Muslims in your country, you don't have to care about this at all, just cross this issue off your whiteboard in a broad stroke. No Muslims - no Muslim radicalism. I don't think this is the solution for USA, but otherwise…

Which countries don't have Muslims?

Re: First they came for the Iranians

#32

Post by guard-of-terra »

EdHominem wrote: post #20
guard-of-terra wrote: post #5

I come from a country which can't keep its le^Wborders closed in front of anyone. So I pity those students a bit, definitely, but otherwise I'm jealous for this policy. It would address my immediate pain had it been implemented here. And yes, I do care more about my own life in a country I am a citizen of, and safety of my relatives, than about people you call "aliens".

Where did that come from? Who's a threat? If there really was a threat it would be reasonable for you to want less immigrants. But there isn't, that's straight up racism. You might as well say you don't want a jew stealing your baby.

Who decides for me what's a threat and what is not?

Isn't there the same sort of people who during Communism decided whether I need any sausage or can go without?

Re: First they came for the Iranians

#33

Post by pcwalton »

guard-of-terra wrote: post #28
threeseed wrote: post #14

Such a cynical yet poorly thought out policy. Firstly, many people involved in terrorist incidents are natural born citizens of allied countries. So are we going to ban all French or Belgium citizens given they have been shown to harbor terrorists ? It's clear that Trump/Bannon desperately want a Muslim ban as opposed to a Iran/Iraq/etc ban. Secondly, this is going to alienate moderate Muslims who Western intelligenc…

If you has Muslims in your country, then yes you might need to work with moderate Muslims in order to be suppressing problem of radicalization. Not sure how well it works tho. But if you do not have Muslims in your country, you don't have to care about this at all, just cross this issue off your whiteboard in a broad stroke. No Muslims - no Muslim radicalism. I don't think this is the solution for USA, but otherwise…

> I don't think this is the solution for USA

I think this may be the first off-topic bomb thrown into a thread I've seen that actually admits that it's off-topic.

Re: First they came for the Iranians

#34

Post by guard-of-terra »

danso wrote: post #31
guard-of-terra wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you has Muslims in your country, then yes you might need to work with moderate Muslims in order to be suppressing problem of radicalization. Not sure how well it works tho. But if you do not have Muslims in your country, you don't have to care about this at all, just cross this issue off your whiteboard in a broad stroke. No Muslims - no Muslim radicalism. I don't think this is the solution for USA, but otherwise…

Which countries don't have Muslims?

Come to think of it, I don't think e.g. Estonia has too many of them. You can probably fit them all in one train.

Re: First they came for the Iranians

#35

Post by helpfulanon »

What's more worrisome is how fervently anti-science the new administration is. Academics may eventually be persecuted in the US across the board - as they are already at the EPA, USDA etc - and regardless of citizenship.

I firmly believe anyone with a brain should begin making contingency plans to regroup somewhere like Australia or Japan, outside of the reaches of far-right populism. An Erdogan-style academic purge may be on the agenda and sooner than we think

Re: First they came for the Iranians

#36

Post by cyberferret »

_m8fo wrote: post #12

I abhor Trump, but something about this statement irks me: > To the Trump regime, I make one request: if you ever decide that it’s the policy of the US government to deport my PhD students, then deport me first. I’m practically begging you: come to my house, arrest me, revoke my citizenship, and tear up the awards I’ve accepted at the White House and the State Department. I’d consider that to be the greatest honor of…

Who knows? It may actually help. The news footage of a middle class white man being dragged away by jack booted thugs may elicit much more attention, sympathy and outrage than a "Middle Eastern looking" man undergoing the same, one would think?

And in this current world awash in pithy slogans, short attention spans and social media generated activism, it may actually be more effective.

Re: First they came for the Iranians

#37

Post by cyberferret »

throwaway2131 wrote: post #27

I am an Iranian CS student. I had a fully funded PhD admission at one of the US universities. I was admitted for the Fall 2016 semester. I am currently in Iran due to my visa not being issued despite the 7 months I have waited for it. I was able to defer my admission to Spring 2017 semester, but then _this_ happened. I am quite sure that I will never be able to attend this program. I had very high hopes for my future…

I am sympathetic to your plight. Why not do as the article suggests and apply to Australia or Canada for your studies? Not sure of the availability of funded PhD research programmes here (Australia), but it may yield quicker results at the moment.

Re: First they came for the Iranians

#38

Post by mnkypete »

throwaway2131 wrote: post #27

I am an Iranian CS student. I had a fully funded PhD admission at one of the US universities. I was admitted for the Fall 2016 semester. I am currently in Iran due to my visa not being issued despite the 7 months I have waited for it. I was able to defer my admission to Spring 2017 semester, but then _this_ happened. I am quite sure that I will never be able to attend this program. I had very high hopes for my future…

It hurts so much to read stories like this, where politics stands in the way of education, especially when the university already approved.

Have you thought about coming to Germany? Not the US, but not bad either..

https://www.daad.de/deutschland/stipendium/en/

Re: First they came for the Iranians

#39

Post by pcwalton »

guard-of-terra wrote: post #32
EdHominem wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where did that come from? Who's a threat? If there really was a threat it would be reasonable for you to want less immigrants. But there isn't, that's straight up racism. You might as well say you don't want a jew stealing your baby.

Who decides for me what's a threat and what is not? Isn't there the same sort of people who during Communism decided whether I need any sausage or can go without?

This article is about the government deciding whether a professor can take on a student or not!
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