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Living in Switzerland ruined me for America and its lousy work culture (2016)

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Re: Living in Switzerland ruined me for America and its lousy work culture (2016)

#71

Post by santaclaus »

Strom wrote: post #64
zigzigzag wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But if the export markets were as rich as Switzerland, they would buy even more luxury watches. So I don't see how your point makes sense. The Swiss model does seem to scale. The population has scaled from 6.2 million in 1970 to about 8.2 million today. GDP per capita also went up significantly during this time, and outpaced GDP per capita growth in the USA. You can find a lot of people who write off the Swiss exampl…

Before anyone thinks Switzerland is some bastion of democracy, I'd like to point out that they've been very conservative in some areas. Women didn't have federal voting rights until 1971, and received nation-wide local voting rights fairly recently in 1991. [1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women's_suffrage_in_Switzerlan...

There is also a fair amount of xenophobia inherent in the Swiss national identity. I know Germans who have lived there for 10+ years and are still considered outsiders.

Re: Living in Switzerland ruined me for America and its lousy work culture (2016)

#72

Post by romanovcode »

dingo_bat wrote: post #2

Lousy work culture that produces the best output in the world. If it is so bad why don't you stay in Switzerland and give up your American passport? Something must be making up for the competitive work culture. I wonder what that is.

Yeah, I hear this argument a lot - "There is a reason why FB, Twitter, etc. is not invented in EU".

Well, TBH I don't give two about those companies. Also, what did average American citizen got from those companies succeeding? Probably nothing.

Thanks, but no thanks. I'd rather have good work-life balance then unicorns that do not even change my life.

Re: Living in Switzerland ruined me for America and its lousy work culture (2016)

#73

Post by hedwall »

robert_foss wrote: post #28
johanbrook wrote: post #11

The U.S. is very behind many European countries in the work-life balance department. It's kinda surprising that America – with its liberal policies for private companies – is so backwards when it comes to caring about their employees. The points in the article could apply to policies/norms in Sweden as well. Here, we get at least 4 weeks of paid vacation per year, as well as some insurances and a very generous parent…

> The points in the article could apply to policies/norms in Sweden as well. Here, we get at least 4 weeks of paid vacation per year No, mandatory EU minimums enforce at least 5 weeks of vacation.

Yes, but you can carry over one week for up to five years. (I know people that does this and takes 10 weeks vacation in one stretch at year 5).

Re: Living in Switzerland ruined me for America and its lousy work culture (2016)

#74

Post by hedwall »

bosie wrote: post #69
robert_foss wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The points in the article could apply to policies/norms in Sweden as well. Here, we get at least 4 weeks of paid vacation per year No, mandatory EU minimums enforce at least 5 weeks of vacation.

do you happen to know how 'vacation' is defined? would it include national holidays?

It does not.

Re: Living in Switzerland ruined me for America and its lousy work culture (2016)

#75

Post by hedwall »

jeffdavis wrote: post #31

Comparisons between the US and European countries are often useless. Either they pick a rich European country that has restricted immigration for a long time, or they say "Western Europe" while ignoring many of the countries in Western Europe that have some real challenges (like unemployment). Germany or the UK might be reasonable comparison points. Not perfect, of course (still huge differences), but it's much more…

Swedens is quite similar and has (until recently) had a very liberal immigraiton policy.

Re: Living in Switzerland ruined me for America and its lousy work culture (2016)

#76

Post by Malice »

santaclaus wrote: post #71
Strom wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Before anyone thinks Switzerland is some bastion of democracy, I'd like to point out that they've been very conservative in some areas. Women didn't have federal voting rights until 1971, and received nation-wide local voting rights fairly recently in 1991. [1] [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Women's_suffrage_in_Switzerlan...

There is also a fair amount of xenophobia inherent in the Swiss national identity. I know Germans who have lived there for 10+ years and are still considered outsiders.

Can you name a place that doesn't have that? I've lived in three different (Western) countries and felt the same thing in all of them.

Re: Living in Switzerland ruined me for America and its lousy work culture (2016)

#78

Post by zigzigzag »

ci5er wrote: post #60
zigzigzag wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But if the export markets were as rich as Switzerland, they would buy even more luxury watches. So I don't see how your point makes sense. The Swiss model does seem to scale. The population has scaled from 6.2 million in 1970 to about 8.2 million today. GDP per capita also went up significantly during this time, and outpaced GDP per capita growth in the USA. You can find a lot of people who write off the Swiss exampl…

> The Swiss model does seem to scale. The population has scaled from 6.2 million in 1970 to about 8.2 million today. GDP per capita also went up significantly during this time, and outpaced GDP per capita growth in the USA. While that is certainly adorable (and, seriously, good for them!), "scale" in GP is referring to: "Will it work for 450M people at the same time?" -- or in China's case: "Will it work for 1.3B peo…

That's obviously unknowable, but I present evidence that the model has scaled. I see no reason why China couldn't become as wealthy as Switzerland if it followed the same models (but I doubt it will any time soon).

Re: Living in Switzerland ruined me for America and its lousy work culture (2016)

#79

Post by yequalsx »

csomar wrote: post #18

In my opinion this is missing an important thing: Does the Swiss model scale? For example, the Singapore model can't scale. It's based on rich people and corporations arbitraging the international fiscal system. You can't have another Singapore without having another East Asia and West with it. Swiss is definitively a privileged place that is benefiting from the overall wealth of Europe and many other countries. We c…

I don't know enough about economics to know for sure one way or the other if the Swiss model scales. I suspect most people responding don't know enough about economics either. I do know it's worth trying and finding out.

Re: Living in Switzerland ruined me for America and its lousy work culture (2016)

#80

Post by kjaer »

louisswiss wrote: post #70
csomar wrote: post #18

In my opinion this is missing an important thing: Does the Swiss model scale? For example, the Singapore model can't scale. It's based on rich people and corporations arbitraging the international fiscal system. You can't have another Singapore without having another East Asia and West with it. Swiss is definitively a privileged place that is benefiting from the overall wealth of Europe and many other countries. We c…

One very important factor which hasn't been mentioned yet is the amazing educational infrastructure in Switzerland. There are truly world-class research universities, well connected business schools and a plethora of well-staffed technical colleges and vocational schools/apprenticeships. Fees don't even reach $2k/year to study at undergraduate/graduate level and children are encouraged to think vocationally from a yo…

I'm currently studying at the EPFL (one of the two Swiss Federal Institutes of Technology) and fees are actually almost half the amount you state -- I pay around 1250$ a year.
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