How to Deal with Populism • Hacker News Board

Re: How to Deal with Populism

#11

Post by zoner » Wed, Jan 25, 2017, 5:08 PM UTC

alva wrote: post #6

How about addressing the widespread concerns that cause "populism" even if it means setting back your own ulterior agenda? Brexit and immigration is a good example of this. Blair decided mass immigration was a good idea for a number of reasons. At some point they surely realised that although it would provide an economic boost, some people would lose out financially and most did not want significant cultural change i…

Exactly the same thinking as mine. And what the liberals are doing? Whining more racism and continuing the same agenda.

Re: How to Deal with Populism

#12

Post by monkmartinez » Wed, Jan 25, 2017, 5:09 PM UTC

santialbo wrote: post #9

In Spain the word populism has turned into an insult that traditional political parties use freely against new political parties even if the statements are perfectly legit (e.g. universal basic income). Is this happening in other countries too?

Not in the US... because we really only have 2 parties, which is extremely unfortunate. We are polarized by design.

Re: How to Deal with Populism

#13

Post by skybrian » Wed, Jan 25, 2017, 5:09 PM UTC

hxegon wrote: post #3

As someone who knows a lot of trump supporters and trump haters, this is what people who are afraid of trump need to recognize. I've seen the advice from this article work first hand, and I've seen people who don't understand what the author is talking about make situations worse first hand.

Interesting. Maybe give some examples?

Re: How to Deal with Populism

#14

Post by dlss » Wed, Jan 25, 2017, 5:10 PM UTC

tptacek wrote: post #10

canadian_voter wrote: post #7

Your organizing principle is simple: don’t feed polarization, disarm it. This is so important. Samantha Bee can't stop making piss jokes about Trump. That's not going to win anyone over. Nina Donovan's poem, recited by Ashley Judd at the Women's March, is brave and powerful. It is also polarizing. There is a line: "I’m not as nasty as a man who looks like he bathes in Cheeto dust." That's not going to win anyone over…

It does not need to be Samantha Bee's job to win everybody over.

> It does not need to be Samantha Bee's job to win everybody over.

Exactly. It's Samantha Bee's job to feed the polarization cycle. If she doesn't, who will?

Re: How to Deal with Populism

#15

Post by bvinc » Wed, Jan 25, 2017, 5:11 PM UTC

canadian_voter wrote: post #7

Your organizing principle is simple: don’t feed polarization, disarm it. This is so important. Samantha Bee can't stop making piss jokes about Trump. That's not going to win anyone over. Nina Donovan's poem, recited by Ashley Judd at the Women's March, is brave and powerful. It is also polarizing. There is a line: "I’m not as nasty as a man who looks like he bathes in Cheeto dust." That's not going to win anyone over…

I want to quote another part of the article that I think is important. Even if you use the right reasons, it's still not effective:

> Don’t waste your time trying to prove that this ism is better than that ism. Ditch all the big words. Why? Because, again, the problem is not the message but the messenger. It’s not that Trump supporters are too stupid to see right from wrong, it’s that you’re much more valuable to them as an enemy than as a compatriot.

> The problem is tribal. Your challenge is to prove that you belong in the same tribe as them: that you are American in exactly the same way they are.

Re: How to Deal with Populism

#16

Post by de_Selby » Wed, Jan 25, 2017, 5:12 PM UTC

alva wrote: post #6

How about addressing the widespread concerns that cause "populism" even if it means setting back your own ulterior agenda? Brexit and immigration is a good example of this. Blair decided mass immigration was a good idea for a number of reasons. At some point they surely realised that although it would provide an economic boost, some people would lose out financially and most did not want significant cultural change i…

I agree completely with your premise but I don't think you've identified the real issue with immigration and brexit - the real underlying issue is unemployment/underemployment, fallout from the financial crisis, near 0% interest rates etc all combining to leave the poor with next to nothing.

Then they see immigrants arriving around the same time all this is happening and assign the blame to them.

Re: How to Deal with Populism

#17

Post by ChrisLTD » Wed, Jan 25, 2017, 5:14 PM UTC

Serious question, does this guy actually know how to deal with populism? Chavez died of cancer, he wasn't defeated politically. Current day Venezuela is led by Chavez's former Vice President.

Re: How to Deal with Populism

#18

Post by tomp » Wed, Jan 25, 2017, 5:15 PM UTC

canadian_voter wrote: post #7

Your organizing principle is simple: don’t feed polarization, disarm it. This is so important. Samantha Bee can't stop making piss jokes about Trump. That's not going to win anyone over. Nina Donovan's poem, recited by Ashley Judd at the Women's March, is brave and powerful. It is also polarizing. There is a line: "I’m not as nasty as a man who looks like he bathes in Cheeto dust." That's not going to win anyone over…

> Again and again, people are attacking Trump for the wrong reasons. Focus on the truly bad.

I disagree. Attacking him at all is a huge mistake, at least until you/the opposition can offer a credible alternative (which Hillary isn't/wasn't). People will put up with all the bad that Trump is, as long as all the alternatives are worse (and yes, economic reasons will trump moral/social reasons for most people except the most well-off).

Re: How to Deal with Populism

#19

Post by midgetjones » Wed, Jan 25, 2017, 5:15 PM UTC

alva wrote: post #6

How about addressing the widespread concerns that cause "populism" even if it means setting back your own ulterior agenda? Brexit and immigration is a good example of this. Blair decided mass immigration was a good idea for a number of reasons. At some point they surely realised that although it would provide an economic boost, some people would lose out financially and most did not want significant cultural change i…

But is migration the direct cause of other people losing out financially?

UKIP know that a lot of people are racist and only too happy to have a finger to point at whatever scapegoat sounds believable to them.

Re: How to Deal with Populism

#20

Post by clueless123 » Wed, Jan 25, 2017, 5:15 PM UTC

Great article but it fails to address a key point of this type of revolutions (I've lived through a couple). Upset people don't like listening to reason. They want relief ( even the promise of it.)