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George Orwell’s 1984 is currently the top selling book on Amazon

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Re: George Orwell’s 1984 is currently the top selling book on Amazon

#52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm really confused by how impeachment works in the U.S. Impeachment requires a crime. Lying isn't usually a crime, and as best I can tell hasn't been one any of the times Trump has done it (.. yet?). It also hasn't been a crime any of the times Obama has done it. Failure to give up business interests is breaking precedent and confounding ethicists, but also doesn't seem to be illegal. When we come up with somethin…

Failure to give up his business interests is an impeachable offense. He literally does not meet the requirements set forth in the Constitution. He isn't being impeached because his party controls both houses.

> He literally does not meet the requirements set forth in the Constitution.

You need to be more specific. If you mean the emoluments clause, I think it's more accurate to say that it's hard to verify whether he meets "the requirements set forth in the Constitution." If you know of an instance of his business accepting a gift from a "king, prince or foreign state" since he's assumed office, then he's actually in violation.

> He isn't being impeached because his party controls both houses.

There is also that. Although I think a not insignificant fraction of that party would much prefer Pence, and if they were going to oust him doing it as far from the next election as possible would seem preferable.

Re: George Orwell’s 1984 is currently the top selling book on Amazon

#53
post #17

I must admit, I'm really confused by how impeachment works in the U.S.. Clinton was impeached for perjury and abuse of power because he took advantage of his position (and a political intern) and then lied about it. Now we have a president who is not giving up his business interests while in office and who has already told some absolute whoppers, including the release of official press releases that were nothing but…

> "alternative facts" I think people are taking this and running at breakneck speed without stopping to look at what they actually mean by this. After watching the first few press conferences and Kelly Anne's interviews where she said that, it seems clear to me they weren't trying to say there were more people physically at the inauguration in their "alternative facts" but what they are referring to specifically is t…

Has anyone actually done an unbiased comparison? I've seen the picture but there are plenty of possible explanations for that.

And people seem to be reading far to much into it in any case.

Re: George Orwell’s 1984 is currently the top selling book on Amazon

#54

Also highly relevant is Aldous Huxley's Brave New World: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brave_New_World

Came here to say this.

I think what we're seeing is a mixture of the two social and political situations: some from column a and some from column b. Turns out they were both right in large measure. In fact, Huxley and Orwell were contemporary and corresponded on the matter -> http://www.lettersofnote.com/2012/03/1984-v-brave-new-world....

Re: George Orwell’s 1984 is currently the top selling book on Amazon

#55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "alternative facts" I think people are taking this and running at breakneck speed without stopping to look at what they actually mean by this. After watching the first few press conferences and Kelly Anne's interviews where she said that, it seems clear to me they weren't trying to say there were more people physically at the inauguration in their "alternative facts" but what they are referring to specifically is t…

> * they are referring to...the viewership* Charitably, Conway might have meant that Trump's inauguration may have been the largest if TV viewers are counted. Unfortunately, that's not what she said. You can't be both unambiguous and wrong, repeatedly, in any human game (EDIT: and win).

Bet you I can!

Re: George Orwell’s 1984 is currently the top selling book on Amazon

#56
post #17

I must admit, I'm really confused by how impeachment works in the U.S.. Clinton was impeached for perjury and abuse of power because he took advantage of his position (and a political intern) and then lied about it. Now we have a president who is not giving up his business interests while in office and who has already told some absolute whoppers, including the release of official press releases that were nothing but…

The whole point of lying is to blur the lines between truth and lies so people believe nothing.

Re: George Orwell’s 1984 is currently the top selling book on Amazon

#57
post #17

I must admit, I'm really confused by how impeachment works in the U.S.. Clinton was impeached for perjury and abuse of power because he took advantage of his position (and a political intern) and then lied about it. Now we have a president who is not giving up his business interests while in office and who has already told some absolute whoppers, including the release of official press releases that were nothing but…

> I'm really confused by how impeachment works in the U.S. Impeachment requires a crime. Lying isn't usually a crime, and as best I can tell hasn't been one any of the times Trump has done it (.. yet?). It also hasn't been a crime any of the times Obama has done it. Failure to give up business interests is breaking precedent and confounding ethicists, but also doesn't seem to be illegal. When we come up with somethin…

We've probably all seen the emoluments clause raised as one way he may be breaking the law. I'm not a legal expert but I would assume, if it's true, that breaking the Constitution would be illegal?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Title_of_Nobility_Clause

"The Title of Nobility Clause is a provision in Article I, Section 9, Clause 8 of the United States Constitution, that ... restricts members of the government from receiving gifts, emoluments, offices or titles from foreign states without the consent of the United States Congress."

I suspect we will hear a lot more about the "consent of Congress" in the next 6 months if this has any merit.

Re: George Orwell’s 1984 is currently the top selling book on Amazon

#58
post #35
post #17

I must admit, I'm really confused by how impeachment works in the U.S.. Clinton was impeached for perjury and abuse of power because he took advantage of his position (and a political intern) and then lied about it. Now we have a president who is not giving up his business interests while in office and who has already told some absolute whoppers, including the release of official press releases that were nothing but…

The process requires a majority of the House, and then it goes to a trial that requires two thirds of the Senate for conviction. Considering the Republicans have a majority in both, I wouldn't get your hopes up.

Exactly. Clinton's impeachment passed the House majority hurdle but never got the 2/3rds majority of the Senate required for the conviction.

Agreed on the Republican majority. I suspect the best the US can hope for is a Republican bloodbath in the 2018 midterms to deliver House and Senate back to Democrat control. I don't believe the chances of that are high though.

Re: George Orwell’s 1984 is currently the top selling book on Amazon

#60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Failure to give up his business interests is an impeachable offense. He literally does not meet the requirements set forth in the Constitution. He isn't being impeached because his party controls both houses.

> He literally does not meet the requirements set forth in the Constitution. You need to be more specific. If you mean the emoluments clause, I think it's more accurate to say that it's hard to verify whether he meets "the requirements set forth in the Constitution." If you know of an instance of his business accepting a gift from a "king, prince or foreign state" since he's assumed office , then he's actually in vio…

Does it say "gifts" or "payments"?
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