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Free Software Foundation Priority Projects

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Re: Free Software Foundation Priority Projects

#121
post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> what's wrong with letting my Siri and your Siri just be two different "people" instead of feeding back into a single, networked hivemind? Absolutely nothing wrong.. that would be great, actually. Question is how to do that without data and GPUs.

It's perfectly okay to say, if you want to get the most out of this program, you need a big GPU rig. The price of such should come down over time. That leaves the question of how to get the data. If you make it optional, will enough people opt in? Is it an acceptable compromise to make it opt-out?

Your idea of opt-{in, out} is a good one. It would integrate enough data with time, I think.

"Open Data Foundation" + "World Wide Distributed Processing" would really make a revolution here. We need break urgently the monopoly over data.

Re: Free Software Foundation Priority Projects

#122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you asking about the effect of the culture of the underrepresented groups keeping them out of tech in general and free software in particular, or about the effect of the culture of overrepresented groups in keeping others out?

I'll take that as implying that the underrepresented groups are not victims of widespread discrimination. One really must struggle to believe - struggle to ignore what we all see in the world and struggle to disregard all the research. The question I ask is: Why struggle? What is the motivation for denying these groups justice? But to clarify one important point: Most discrimination is ignorance, IMHO, not intentiona…

> I'll take that as implying that the underrepresented groups are not victims of widespread discrimination.

That was not my intent, as I certainly don't beleive that. Rather, I wanted to disambiguate the GP question (which could be taken either way).

Perhaps I should have shortened my request for clarification to "which culture and what effect are you asking about?"

Anyway, over/under representation happens through many avenues, some through overt and intentional discrimination, and much more through secondary and tertiary effects, many of which reinforce each other through positive feedback loops (not to mention reinforcing the overt and intentional sort as well).

eg. once you control for sibling order, parents' educational background and income, etc., it is clear that on average girls get their first computer at a later age than boys by several years. If a computer is supposed to be shared between siblings and it isn't in a common area it will tend to go into the boy's room. and so on.

Parents aren't deliberately reinforcing gender stereotypes to reduce their daughters' opportunities to discourage them from using computers, but that's exactly what is happening, and this is entirely a cultural phenomenon.

You can in many other cases measure a discouraging effect from within the culture of an underrepresented group, but just because it is worth noting however and whenever a group is complicit in their underrepresentation, it does not magically shift responsibility away from members of an over-represented group to accept changes to their culture to stop discouraging and excluding others, most specifically in this case any beleifs that participation in Free Software is entirely based on merit.

Re: Free Software Foundation Priority Projects

#123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's no force keeping people from contributing, they are just choosing not to. We all naturally have tunnel vision, and apply our experience to everyone else. I can't speak for you, but many people who don't face discrimination naturally don't encounter the obstacles and don't feel negatively toward minorities; they assume that therefore such things don't exist. But something is missing from our perception, beca…

What affect does culture and income have on the prevalence of people in tech? Do white people who come from a poor background get into IT more than black people with poor backgrounds? What leads me to believe culture has more of an affect nowadays than race is the fact that Asians have higher average incomes than whites, even though they were also historically subjected to racism.

> culture has more of an affect nowadays than race

You are opposing "race" and "culture" when race is in large part a cultural construct.

Re: Free Software Foundation Priority Projects

#124
post #63

if FSF wants a intelligent assistant it will have to collect usage data, no? a little against the whole principle... but if the data are open, that would be kind of cool ;)

> if FSF wants a intelligent assistant it will have to collect usage data Well, not necessarily (although that is certainly the path of least resistance). However, even if data collection is necessary, there are ways of doing it in a privacy- and freedom-respecting manner.

Gathering data in privacy- and freedom-respecting manner is something I'd really like to learn about. Any sources or reading material for this?

Re: Free Software Foundation Priority Projects

#125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if FSF wants a intelligent assistant it will have to collect usage data Well, not necessarily (although that is certainly the path of least resistance). However, even if data collection is necessary, there are ways of doing it in a privacy- and freedom-respecting manner.

Gathering data in privacy- and freedom-respecting manner is something I'd really like to learn about. Any sources or reading material for this?

Sure:

At a process level look at how researchers share anonymized data about patients in clinical trials for one example.

Technical solutions (some of which use cryptographic techniques) exist as well, many of which are described in Peter Wayner's book Translucent Databases: http://www.wayner.org/node/39

Re: Free Software Foundation Priority Projects

#126
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given the popularity of SaaS and Electron apps, I think everyone lost the battle for the desktop.

What's wrong with Electron apps?

The only well-written Electron app I'm aware of is VSCode.

Everything else is slow, memory hungry, and insanely bloated.

Re: Free Software Foundation Priority Projects

#127
post #11

This is the right thing to do and I hope it is not too little too late. Free/libre OSS won the battle for the server, lost the battle for the desktop, but desktop is not (that) relevant anymore. FLOSS phone ecosystem will be hard to next to impossible, in my opinion, but worth going into. Self-hosted server side software has a very good chance of succeeding. For a long time I essentially wanted something like Synolog…

> Free/libre OSS won the battle for the server, lost the battle for the desktop, but desktop is not (that) relevant anymore. Desktop won't stop being relevant in the foreseeable future - there is nothing to replace it with for a whole variety of tasks. And usage of Linux on the desktop is gradually growing.

I'm a Linux desktop user myself, but what evidence do you have to support that Linux desktop is growing?

Re: Free Software Foundation Priority Projects

#128
post #114

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then let's rephrase to meet that cavil - there's far too much irrelevant, futile and stupendously wasteful politics, then. The (yes, political) goal of free software is wonderful. Copyleft is a great invention. But the continued insistence on grabbing patents or even obviating patent law in its entire from within a software license - and also the mission to prevent tivoization (which I might want to protect my OS fro…

Clearly you share the goal but not the politics in how to reach it. That happens in practically every political movement. Let imagine a similar comment for ecopolitics: "The goal of ecopolitics is wonderful. Green energy is a great invention. But the continued insistence on reduced emissions or even a stop to burning fossil fuels in its entire - and also the mission to prevent non-ecological farming (which make food…

So, here you are "strenuously agreeing" with me that the original statement was false. We both think that "saying it has too much politics behind it is an oxymoron" is false. You and I agree that one can think that the ice cream cone might have one too many toppings, and to utter such a statement ain't oxymoronic - debatable, but not in any way contradictory. In fact, you think "too much politics" is a common cry. Yes, it is a common kind of debate, but not therefore trivial - since one might end up with a lot of ice cream on one's shirt if the pile of toppings is too high. I think that's already happened.

The more people try to bundle what are in fact quite distinct aims into one movement, the greater chance of failure. Not to mention the greater chance of including an aim which is harmful, not helpful. So I'll stand by my thought that adding in the defeating-the-patent-system-or-bust goal was maybe a tad much.

Nobody doubts that politics are complex and divisions common therein; but surely it's also obvious that politic movements can vary in complexity (number of toppings,) too.

One can't always follow Lincoln's first law of strategy: "One war at a time", but it's an excellent rule of thumb, for politics as well as war, and I think it's pretty clear to most of us now that the EFF has wandered much too far from it, with (economically) catastrophic results - namely all those wasted billions, not to mention the limited supply of developer work-years thrown away on mere rewrites. Not every political movement overreaches anything like this badly.

That there are other arguments with a similar structure to mine does not distress me. That other, false axioms plugged into the same structure might produce a false result doesn't - and of course shouldn't - dismay me either. (Which is not to take one side in the example argument you cite. Not here, anyway.)

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