Don't Be a Free User (2011) • Hacker News Board

Re: Don't Be a Free User (2011)

#11

Post by lucb1e » Sat, Jan 21, 2017, 1:41 PM UTC

andrewclunn wrote: post #8

wmeredith wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He addresses this in the article.

Oh wow. Read it but somehow missed that. Well I'll leave the foot in mouth comment for posterity.

I missed it as well. For future readers:

> free web services are not like free software. If your free software project suddenly gets popular, you gain resources: testers, developers and people willing to pitch in. If your free website takes off, you lose resources. Your time is spent firefighting and your money all goes to the nice people at Linode.

Re: Don't Be a Free User (2011)

#12

Post by moolcool » Sat, Jan 21, 2017, 1:47 PM UTC

thatlooper wrote: post #9

So what about HackerNews?

I don't think of HN like a product meant to make money though, more like a big ad for YC

Re: Don't Be a Free User (2011)

#13

Post by countryqt30 » Sat, Jan 21, 2017, 1:48 PM UTC

SUMMARY: The basic essence of the article is: "have a positive per-unit cost argument from day 1"

There was much said for and against this very topic already and now you can decide, once again, for yourself. Nothing unique in this article, sorry.

Re: Don't Be a Free User (2011)

#14

Post by nerdponx » Sat, Jan 21, 2017, 1:54 PM UTC

This is why web services should be open source and available for self hosting:

- The geeks with the know-how to run a Web server benefit from your product for free, but in exchange you get bug reports, patches, etc.

- Everyone else pays, because you also offer a paid hosting option.

But because the product is fundamentally open source and federated, it can and hopefully will outlive its original developer.

Re: Don't Be a Free User (2011)

#15

Post by lqdc13 » Sat, Jan 21, 2017, 2:02 PM UTC

lucb1e wrote: post #11

andrewclunn wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh wow. Read it but somehow missed that. Well I'll leave the foot in mouth comment for posterity.

I missed it as well. For future readers: > free web services are not like free software. If your free software project suddenly gets popular, you gain resources: testers, developers and people willing to pitch in. If your free website takes off, you lose resources. Your time is spent firefighting and your money all goes to the nice people at Linode.

It depends on the service, but I think the vast majority of free products are over engineered in terms of using cloud services.

It costs something like $60 a month in maintenance fees for 1 VPS. Double that and you are safe from hardware outages.

As a dating site for example, you don't need S3, cloud formation, etc.

Re: Don't Be a Free User (2011)

#16

Post by devoply » Sat, Jan 21, 2017, 2:02 PM UTC

nerdponx wrote: post #14

This is why web services should be open source and available for self hosting: - The geeks with the know-how to run a Web server benefit from your product for free, but in exchange you get bug reports, patches, etc. - Everyone else pays, because you also offer a paid hosting option. But because the product is fundamentally open source and federated, it can and hopefully will outlive its original developer.

Going open source does not save any project. It's just a different way of doing things. If the project is not profitable, it will still go under while being open source with a hosted business model. The question is does this sort of model work with _your_ project.

There have been open source projects that used it just as marketing tool and then shut down the open source version when they grew popular enough. There have been those which have severely limited the open source version to get people to buy the premium version which is hosted.

At the end you are dealing with locusts, they will consume anything of value to them for free without giving a damn about its implications to the future survival of the product. Altruism is nice, but it's not business savvy.

Re: Don't Be a Free User (2011)

#17

Post by earlyriser » Sat, Jan 21, 2017, 2:03 PM UTC

moolcool wrote: post #12

thatlooper wrote: post #9

So what about HackerNews?

I don't think of HN like a product meant to make money though, more like a big ad for YC

A big ad and recruiting board for the right demography.

Re: Don't Be a Free User (2011)

#18

Post by devoply » Sat, Jan 21, 2017, 2:07 PM UTC

akjainaj wrote: post #10

I am a proud free user. When a service closes because of bankruptcy, a new one always appears. Or maybe two or three. So who cares? There's always a free alternative to every service, especially web ones.

Thank you Mr. Locust, that will do.

Re: Don't Be a Free User (2011)

#19

Post by gilrain » Sat, Jan 21, 2017, 2:08 PM UTC

devoply wrote: post #18

akjainaj wrote: post #10

I am a proud free user. When a service closes because of bankruptcy, a new one always appears. Or maybe two or three. So who cares? There's always a free alternative to every service, especially web ones.

Thank you Mr. Locust, that will do.

A workable analogy only if farmers were actually clamoring to market their fields to locusts.

Re: Don't Be a Free User (2011)

#20

Post by devoply » Sat, Jan 21, 2017, 2:10 PM UTC

gilrain wrote: post #19

devoply wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you Mr. Locust, that will do.

A workable analogy only if farmers were actually clamoring to market their fields to locusts.

I was referring to this: http://www.ribbonfarm.com/2013/04/03/the-locust-economy/