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The World’s Most Innovative Economies

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Re: The World’s Most Innovative Economies

#41
post #28
post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Sweden is perhaps one of the most individualistic country in the world: we value the individual over the family or community, and we believe that everyone should have the same opportunities regardless of the circumstances of their birth. This is the reason we have the social safety net we have: it is a substitute for family and community and other more traditional support systems. I think this has its costs; humans…

Oh, yes, I totally agree! There's a very steep cost to this model of "Swedish-style individualism", and it's exactly the one you describe. Swedes have much weaker bonds to their extended family, their community, their religious institutions (etc.) and it's clearly not a good thing. Humans are social animals. I'm not necessarily arguing that Sweden is a model society and all other countries should adopt our ways. What…

Is there a way to measure the strength of those bonds?

We in America are very individualistic (eg "I got mine, screw you!" because Freedom Markets™). Our elder care is terrible. Our nursing homes are bleak.

(A buddy worked as the CFO for a nursing home corporation. Told me the biggest thing he learned: Don't end up in a nursing home.)

Re: The World’s Most Innovative Economies

#42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's very much a cultural thing. Much of the social system in the US is informal. For example in the American South, things like the Salvation Army are huge and lots of small churches have homeless programs, food drives, and facilities that push for employment skills. Of course that ties a lot of dogma into social help, but it's there. Sweden, having a much smaller government with fewer conflicting factions i…

I think by social system he includes the health services. A similar notion about Norway singled out the public health services as an enabler for someone to come up with an idea and start their own business without worrying about things like health insurance. Thus the business could grow more organically than the pump and dump VC circus seen in USA.

Health services in Sweden is going down hill fast, I've heard. Money issues. They are trying to save money wherever they can. The recent sudden influx of foreigners didn't help. They say Sweden couldn't really afford taking in any foreigners but did it anyway. Sweden shooting itself in the foot. It sounds like.

Perhaps someone can give a recent update on this?

Re: The World’s Most Innovative Economies

#43

> South Korea remained the big winner, topping the international charts in R&D intensity, value-added manufacturing and patent activity and with top-five rankings in high-tech density, higher education and researcher concentration None of these are really all that relevant to true innovation. As a European, it's clear to me that no country comes even close to the US in terms of innovation. Almost all really new techn…

> Almost all really new technologies come out of the US. I would add: Almost all really new technologies in the market come out of the US. US is the best at transforming research in $.

This seems like the true approach.

Re: The World’s Most Innovative Economies

#44
I wonder: what's the point of a ranking like this?

It's got China wedged between Canada and Poland. On the one hand, on average this is probably correct: there are vast swathes of inland China that are undoubtedly quite stultifying and wouldn't rank highly on any "innovation" metric. On the hand, if you're interested in this kind of innovation, then what does rural China have to do with anything? The innovations happening in Shanghai and Beijing and Shenzhen and Chengdu are very innovative indeed, and ought to rank near the top of any global list. Certainly much higher than anything you could find in Poland or Canada (meaning no disrespect).

I'd suggest that it's problematic for a ranking like this to even be based on countries. Countries, per se, don't produce innovation: urban economies do. A ranking of innovative cities would be a much more interesting and realistic metric.

Re: The World’s Most Innovative Economies

#45
post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Read somewhere that the chance of having higher intelligence is reflected in how self-sufficient you are. People with higher intelligence tend to manage just fine with a small social group with weak connections. The more social you are the more likely that you have lower intelligence. Sort of suggests that following the collective, being an ant in a colony may have negative effects on intelligence over a few generati…

That would have no effect over just a few generations.

It's figure of speech.

Re: The World’s Most Innovative Economies

#46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think by social system he includes the health services. A similar notion about Norway singled out the public health services as an enabler for someone to come up with an idea and start their own business without worrying about things like health insurance. Thus the business could grow more organically than the pump and dump VC circus seen in USA.

Health services in Sweden is going down hill fast, I've heard. Money issues. They are trying to save money wherever they can. The recent sudden influx of foreigners didn't help. They say Sweden couldn't really afford taking in any foreigners but did it anyway. Sweden shooting itself in the foot. It sounds like. Perhaps someone can give a recent update on this?

I suspect that is scaremongering from the suits that wants to let in American style for profit medical services.

Same shits been going on in Norway for decades.

Re: The World’s Most Innovative Economies

#47
post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Almost all really new technologies come out of the US. I would add: Almost all really new technologies in the market come out of the US. US is the best at transforming research in $.

This seems like the true approach.

And arguably, the more valuable one. Bringing something to the masses

a) which used to be expensive but is now cheap or

b) which is new but affordable for most

is what changes people's lives.

Re: The World’s Most Innovative Economies

#48
post #30
post #15

>The Swedes themselves promote an atmosphere of great personal ambition — unlike some European neighbors that emphasize the collective — and that’s a boon to innovation, he said. >“In the culture, people are super individualistic — this means that people have ideas and are very interested in pursuing them in this way in order to become wealthy,” said Henrekson. This is very true, and a thing which is often misunderst…

I think you are applying your own values to the population as a whole. Depending on ones ethnicity, social class, and other variables, one may, as a Swede, value family or community over the individual.

I'm speaking in aggregates, certainly, different people will have different values. But the idea is generally true, and it is backed by studies measuring values.

In addition, this was an explicitly stated goal in the creation of the Swedish welfare state. The Social Democratic "philosophy" underlying it goes by the name of "Folkhemmet"[1], "the people's home". The idea is that in order to progress to a more modern economy, the state should take over the more traditional support systems previously provided by family/community/religion/etc. when it comes to things like healthcare, education and taking care of the poor.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Folkhemmet

Re: The World’s Most Innovative Economies

#49

> South Korea remained the big winner, topping the international charts in R&D intensity, value-added manufacturing and patent activity and with top-five rankings in high-tech density, higher education and researcher concentration None of these are really all that relevant to true innovation. As a European, it's clear to me that no country comes even close to the US in terms of innovation. Almost all really new techn…

I think this is a bias because we only read American media and are flooded by American influence. Countries like Sweden, Switzerland have innovative universities highly ranked. A huge density of startups close to them. High technologies and services available to citizens (for example bank system, rail system, fiber to the home...). And of course a social and retirement system that gives the whole population a really high power of consumption. They are small countries that are easier to manage. But they definitely deserve their rank in my own humble opinion.

Re: The World’s Most Innovative Economies

#50
post #15

>The Swedes themselves promote an atmosphere of great personal ambition — unlike some European neighbors that emphasize the collective — and that’s a boon to innovation, he said. >“In the culture, people are super individualistic — this means that people have ideas and are very interested in pursuing them in this way in order to become wealthy,” said Henrekson. This is very true, and a thing which is often misunderst…

While I agree with your overall point I unfortunately don't think your characterization of Sweden is true anymore.

Your education prospects now depend on which school you go to, especially with blatant grade inflation. My friends are putting their kids in queue for elite elementary school the day after they are born. Even if you can make it to college the traditional route you'll have trouble finding an apartment and keeping your student benefits.

Healthcare is a complicated system of public funded private institutions that regularly and willingly violate the law on things like time before you get to see a specialist. I always used to like the Swedish healthcare system until I realized I've always visited the same doctors that I knew.

Unemployment benefits doesn't apply (or atleast appeal) to former students or short contract workers these days. You have to go the welfare office and even they have no problem denying you means. You'll probably won't have much job security anyways since you'll be hired as a contractor.

Housing, especially in Stockholm, is a mess that won't be solved anytime soon. It makes the effects of everything worse. Commute time, work-life balance, even the weather.

I honestly think Sweden is one of the best countries in the world, but it's not a good deal anymore. If you got established ten years ago and could go to school before rampant youth unemployment, got an apartment before housing prices skyrocketed, know which doctors to go to, get a stable job where it makes sense to join the union etc. then it's great. You can study at university for seven years, some of them abroad, work for a few years, go on paternity leave for the better part of a year, move abroad for some time, then come back to your stable job again, leave your employer and get hired back as a consultant and if you don't find work go on unemployment. All this while you make a workers salary in housing appreciation, take vacations three times a year and get to use your parent country house in the summers.

Bottom line is that increasingly only the rich can afford to take advantage of the social safety net these days and I think it's starting to show even with things like startups. It was apparent very early that companies like Spotify, Klarna, Mojang etc. would be successful. I don't see many of these types of early successes anymore (but that might be my own ignorance of course).

There's increasingly nothing special about Sweden.

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