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Ask HN: Is it possible to make $200K/year base salary?

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Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to make $200K/year base salary?

#71

Post by memmove33 »

mailshanx wrote: post #63
memmove33 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Poor formatting (editing from mobile). $150k is base salary. $1.8M is the additional RSU grant with 4 year vesting schedule heavily negotiated prior to joining (in these examples, with a bidding war between google, fb and another very big company). Also, I can personally testify how important negotiating the offer is. I routinely (every ~2y) interview to discover my market value and, from a position of power (e.g. "W…

Would be great if you could impart some offer negotiation advise! I was once interviewing with the fruit company. The HR guy was very aggressive, and insisted that I reveal all details of my current comp before we proceed further. This was after I was referred by an employee and already had an conversation with the team lead. After I revealed my comp, he acted very surprised about how high it was, and about how diffi…

As fuzzy-logic said, just don't reveal your total comp, and be willing to walk away from it for real (walking away from such juicy offers requires the most determination, so it's important you do it from a position of power, for example if you already have a good job, otherwise they have you by the balls).

The only case where it can be beneficial to disclose something about your compensation is if you have deferred compensation (e.g. stock options) that you want your potential new employer to somehow consider in the offer. In that case, sharing a copy of the grant is the easiest thing to do, and doesn't hurt much

Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to make $200K/year base salary?

#72

Post by mailshanx »

memmove33 wrote: post #71
mailshanx wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would be great if you could impart some offer negotiation advise! I was once interviewing with the fruit company. The HR guy was very aggressive, and insisted that I reveal all details of my current comp before we proceed further. This was after I was referred by an employee and already had an conversation with the team lead. After I revealed my comp, he acted very surprised about how high it was, and about how diffi…

As fuzzy-logic said, just don't reveal your total comp, and be willing to walk away from it for real (walking away from such juicy offers requires the most determination, so it's important you do it from a position of power, for example if you already have a good job, otherwise they have you by the balls). The only case where it can be beneficial to disclose something about your compensation is if you have deferred c…

I see. How does one then approach the topic of compensation, and determine if the two parties at at least in the same ballpark?

Do you postpone comp-talk until an offer is on the table? Or is it safe to assume that large companies generally have an extremely elastic range?

Do you think it's a good idea say something like "If you can offer $OBVIOUSLY_EXTREMELY_HIGH, i will immediately accept. For lesser offers, i will evaluate them on a case by case basis."

Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to make $200K/year base salary?

#73

Post by mailshanx »

memmove33 wrote: post #68
bsvalley wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't believe it. 1.8M - 3M in RSU grant at google/FB? I have never heard of such a thing for an engineer. It's director level MINIMUM.

One last data point for you and then I'll stop, since you don't seem willing to believe me anyway. Did you ever read Chaos Monkey? ( https://www.amazon.com/Chaos-Monkeys-Obscene-Fortune-Failure... ) The author was a founder of a very little startup (3-men shop) and after 6 months tried to approach Facebook to be acquired, and Facebook told him: we don't want your technology, but since you have proven to be capable of…

I would be grateful to hear their story and learn from it. If you prefer to keep that private, can i email you (your profile doesn't have an email)?

Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to make $200K/year base salary?

#75

Post by nunez »

erubin wrote: post #49
bsvalley wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rarely, if you join as a senior engineer at AmaGooFaceSoftApple you won't make 200k base salary. This will be mostly stocks.

I'm not sure why you don't consider stock in a public company that you can immediately sell every monthly vesting period liquid.

Because you have to work for several years (4 at Google) before you can liquidate them completely (don't forget about taxes) and you have to rely on non-deterministic factors to keep that train going (stock refreshes, raises, promo bonuses, etc.)

Salary is much more straightforward, and more predictable.

Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to make $200K/year base salary?

#76

Post by melmoth »

nunez wrote: post #74

Not possible, for the most part, as an IC. There are exceptions, though. 10000% possible in management, sales and executive positions. That's my observation anyway. That's also the reason why I'm making the move into this territory.

It's definitely possible in SF. I joined a mid-stage startup a year ago as an IC staff engineer type at a little over $200k base, plus bonus, plus RSU equity. I have significant management experience, but joined as an IC. Base would likely be even higher at a company like Google, LinkedIn, Facebook.

Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to make $200K/year base salary?

#77

Post by bsvalley »

mwpmaybe wrote: post #70
bsvalley wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

an individual Contributor is an employee who doesn't have any direct reports.

A manager-level employee.

the opposite. No one reports to that employee. (my previous message was confusing sorry).

Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to make $200K/year base salary?

#78

Post by bsvalley »

memmove33 wrote: post #68
bsvalley wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't believe it. 1.8M - 3M in RSU grant at google/FB? I have never heard of such a thing for an engineer. It's director level MINIMUM.

One last data point for you and then I'll stop, since you don't seem willing to believe me anyway. Did you ever read Chaos Monkey? ( https://www.amazon.com/Chaos-Monkeys-Obscene-Fortune-Failure... ) The author was a founder of a very little startup (3-men shop) and after 6 months tried to approach Facebook to be acquired, and Facebook told him: we don't want your technology, but since you have proven to be capable of…

Now that all make sense... The acqui-hire situation is another topic. Millions of dollars are spent when it comes to people acquisition. And indeed, companies are usually willing to get what they need no matter what. Any random software engineer with 10 years of exp can't get that in the valley by applying at Google. That would cost Google a lot of money... Plus, there's no real negotiation when you sent out your Resume asking them to hire you... they have full control. You might get a 10k sign-on bonus just by asking. That's it

Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to make $200K/year base salary?

#79

Post by IdontRememberIt »

dlp211 wrote: post #62
iplaw wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think that you grossly overestimate what a $200k income actually gets you in terms of ability to aggregate wealth. If you're hoping to work until you're 65 and live off of a meager 401(k), then sure. Have at it. If you want an early and fat retirement, you'll need at least $300k salary. Large annual bonuses ($100k-$250k range) with a $200k salary would also be sufficient. $200k salary alone is solidly middle class.

This is absolutely nuts to me. At 200k you should be able to put away 80k+/yr if you are even semi-serious about FIRE. At that rate with a 7 percent return, adjusted for inflation, after 20 years you'd have 3.5MM in assets which would provide a safe withdraw rate of 140k/yr. This assumes that you make not a single dollar more adjusted for inflation than that 200k. 140k/yr is nearly 3x median income in America. This i…

A 7 percent return is impossible without investing in crazy ultra risky financial products. The only vehicule where everybody (especially people close to retirement or retired) is investing is real estate (which is also ultra risky). Please thanks the FED for that.

Re: Ask HN: Is it possible to make $200K/year base salary?

#80

Post by gizmo »

IdontRememberIt wrote: post #79
dlp211 wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is absolutely nuts to me. At 200k you should be able to put away 80k+/yr if you are even semi-serious about FIRE. At that rate with a 7 percent return, adjusted for inflation, after 20 years you'd have 3.5MM in assets which would provide a safe withdraw rate of 140k/yr. This assumes that you make not a single dollar more adjusted for inflation than that 200k. 140k/yr is nearly 3x median income in America. This i…

A 7 percent return is impossible without investing in crazy ultra risky financial products. The only vehicule where everybody (especially people close to retirement or retired) is investing is real estate (which is also ultra risky). Please thanks the FED for that.

How much the market returns varies wildly between decades, but 7% is what you will get on average through passive investing. You don't need to take big risks -- plain index funds will do. Millenials are unlikely to see the stock market drop by more than 40% during their lifetime.
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