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Why Many Cities Have No Money

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Re: Why Many Cities Have No Money

#71
post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think this is one of the main drivers in favoring cheap and punishing quality. The problem comes with evaluating quality. There are issues with over-valuing cheapness, but there are equally issues with using high-cost as an indicator of quality too.

Could cities not do something where they pay 50% of the construction bill over the expected lifetime of the project, with a big chunk of it at the end? The cost of unexpected repairs would simply get deducted from this money. It would mean that only big companies could take on these projects (because they'd only be making 50% of their money right away), but they could still subcontract out to smaller companies and pa…

If >50% of the cost is maintenance then those companies could still build it cheaply then laugh all the way to the bank.

Re: Why Many Cities Have No Money

#72
post #58
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are significant economies of scale for infrastructure that happen with density. The amount of road surface a tall, mixed-use building requires per occupant is dramatically less than what a detached single family home does, but the latter road needs more maintenance than what the taxes on that single-family home provide for.

Density brings costs of its own, though. There's a reason everything is more expensive in dense areas.

And this article brings up that one reason it is more expensive is that dense areas subsidize less dense areas of a city.

Re: Why Many Cities Have No Money

#73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Town's have totally different economics. My town is fiscally solvent, takes are of it's infrastructure, and doesn't much raise taxes. And we are very spread out, with an average lot size of 2 acres. Small roads are the responsibility of the town. Bigger roads (there aren't many) are the responsibility of the county. I'll claim that the layout of the town doesn't matter nearly as much as the fiscal discipline of the t…

That's not quite correct... fiscal discipline isn't going to make most suburb-heavy cities in America solvent. You can't cut your way to profitability in the long term, you can only stave off bankruptcy in the short term. The article is saying that mostly-suburb cities are not sustainable. They cost more to build and maintain over the long term than the majority of cities can recoup in taxes. That has little to do wi…

You are indeed supporting my assertion that towns have different economics. Mine is an old suburb (1920s) of a medium-sized city (Pittsburgh). And as I stated, our town is sustainable. We have "more" parks not "fewer parks". Parks require much less maintenance cost than does residential spaces(plus much is done by volunteers). I'll also assert again that how "spread out" things are doesn't matter. If anything, denser clusters will have lower maintenance costs (less digging).

So how can we make cities have the same fiscal discipline of towns? We'd have to reverse the land-grab of the cities. Have them split into fiscal units the same size as my town (20K people). Have the managers have to come ask those residence to approve their budget.

Same issue with schools. Why does the Pittsburgh city school district spend the same per pupil as the suburbs, but the such worse results? Lack of fiscal discipline.

Re: Why Many Cities Have No Money

#74
post #19
post #5

In the intro, it is stated that "literally five or less" cities do not have these monetary problems. I'm curious what those cities are, and why are they special. If the answer isn't "they've always used accrual accounting", I don't buy that most cities are doomed due to accounting problems.

I think you may have misread the article; it seemed to me that blame was placed much more on political incentives to encourage outward, sparse suburban growth. The kind of growth which incurs enormously more infrastructure cost per capita. Not on accounting practices.

Although there may be an argument that suburbs would never have been built if the infrastructure costs were front-loaded (e.g. >5% property tax).

Re: Why Many Cities Have No Money

#75
post #18

I can't say much about mathematics of taxes described in the article, but I always thought that Soviet Union got a lot of it's city planning very much right. Even a small town is built as a relatively tight formation of high-rises, yet leaving plenty of public space and greenery in the middle. The quality of life in the town that I grew up in is super high, because everything one might need: school, hospital, store,…

Part of the problem in the US is too much planning, alongside too many subsidies for cars. Look at a zoning map of any city: there's an incredible level of detail about what's permitted where. The local zoning code here in Bend, until recently, had a section on how many parking spots per customer for barber shops. As if, in a competitive market, those businesses couldn't figure out for themselves the optimal amount of parking to pay for to keep their customers happy.

Most of Europe is pretty walkable and it doesn't have that 'planned' look either.

Re: Why Many Cities Have No Money

#76
post #57
post #18

I can't say much about mathematics of taxes described in the article, but I always thought that Soviet Union got a lot of it's city planning very much right. Even a small town is built as a relatively tight formation of high-rises, yet leaving plenty of public space and greenery in the middle. The quality of life in the town that I grew up in is super high, because everything one might need: school, hospital, store,…

But isn't this what public housing projects in the US did, and are now considered massive failures?

Well, the theory, as I've heard an urban planner explain in a video, is that the problem with projects is that they are populated by people of exactly the same class. A mixed income/background area is less likely to turn into what projects did. I'm just quoting somebody else here, won't claim that it's a fact.

Re: Why Many Cities Have No Money

#77

"This isn't a political, cultural or social failing." - Wrong this is 100% a political failing. This doesn't happen in the private sector.

The author chooses to describe the phenomenon like,

  Psychologists call this temporal discounting. Humans are
  predisposed to highly value pleasure today and to deeply
  discount future pain, especially the more distant it is.
I'm not sure that's the best way to describe it. And there are other ways to describe the basic phenomenon. But in any event the private sector is not at all immune. But because the tasks we delegate to private companies are different from those we delegate to public institutions, manifestations of the phenomenon tend to cluster into seemingly distinct categories.

In the private sphere a similar phenomenon (if not conceptually identical at some level of abstraction) more often encountered is pollution. Or in Silicon Valley think of "technical debt". Both of these are costs that private actors accrue and that, because they do not need to internalize them immediately, are discounted inaccurately because of the temporal bias of the agents. In both cases, when the private actor eventually goes belly-up, other actors (public and private) are often left holding the bag to clean up the mess. And thus the original private actor has effectively imposed a hidden cost on others, intentionally or unintentionally, producing globally suboptimal results.

It's easy to see how an enormous network of pavement and pipes could be created and then left to rot and blight the environment by both private and public entities. Detroit is a prime example of both.

It's worth pointing out that like phenomena described by prospect theory, this temporal bias likely evolved as a heuristic device. Nothing in the future is certain--not even in probabilistic terms--and so it's not possible to foresee and accurately price all future costs today. There's no obvious alternative to the bias as a general matter, only in specific circumstances.

At the end of the day, to aliens arriving on planet earth and watching the machinations of our civilization, distinctions between private and public would really be quite artificial and perhaps not even the most informative axis on which to bifurcate our economy. Both private and public actors are subject to market forces, just like both boats and airplanes are subject to gravity. The normative mechanisms we choose in our attempts to optimize how actors respond to preferences and to internalize costs are different, but rarely singular--it's always some mix of policy and currency, among other things. The so-called "free market" approach is hardly, if ever, the best answer alone.

Re: Why Many Cities Have No Money

#78
post #11

There's a blog I enjoy that covers this sort of issue very frequently. It's interesting to see a hard data approach to explaining some of the municipal funding problems that are brewing nationwide. https://granolashotgun.com/2016/08/31/a-thousand-hidden-subs...

His stuff is frequently featured on Strong Towns as well, if I recall correctly.

Re: Why Many Cities Have No Money

#79
post #75
post #18

I can't say much about mathematics of taxes described in the article, but I always thought that Soviet Union got a lot of it's city planning very much right. Even a small town is built as a relatively tight formation of high-rises, yet leaving plenty of public space and greenery in the middle. The quality of life in the town that I grew up in is super high, because everything one might need: school, hospital, store,…

Part of the problem in the US is too much planning, alongside too many subsidies for cars. Look at a zoning map of any city: there's an incredible level of detail about what's permitted where. The local zoning code here in Bend, until recently, had a section on how many parking spots per customer for barber shops. As if, in a competitive market, those businesses couldn't figure out for themselves the optimal amount o…

Oh, it was definitely "planned" in the modern era. You can see similar problems to the states in many European suburbs (though not as bad because a lot more planning).

Re: Why Many Cities Have No Money

#80
post #58
post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are significant economies of scale for infrastructure that happen with density. The amount of road surface a tall, mixed-use building requires per occupant is dramatically less than what a detached single family home does, but the latter road needs more maintenance than what the taxes on that single-family home provide for.

Density brings costs of its own, though. There's a reason everything is more expensive in dense areas.

Actually, dense stuff is mostly cheaper until you start building way up. Tons of Italy is pretty dense and is not all that expensive in the grand scheme of things. It's also very livable and walkable. Same goes for many other places in Europe.
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