When You Are Depressed, Make Something • Hacker News Board

Re: When You Are Depressed, Make Something

#271

Post by sorryisaidthat » Tue, Jan 10, 2017, 8:52 PM UTC

EGreg wrote: post #101

sixo wrote: post #80

When you are depressed, see if there's a serious problem in your life that is causing you to be depressed and devote as much time and energy as you can muster towards exploring solutions to that problem, even if they entail dramatic life-changing decisions, because that's the kind of problem we're dealing with here. Examples of such problems: you hate your graduate program. You have no friends in your city and no ide…

What do you guys think is the point of all our activities if people eventually die? Most mainstream Judaeo-Christian postulates the immortality of the soul. But it seems to come up against mainstream history and science. Hasn't anyone here felt these existential questions? Even if you accomplish so much, in the end you can't even answer basic questions about the meaning of it all. You can consile yourself with the id…

This is the focus of the book of Ecclesiastes.

Re: When You Are Depressed, Make Something

#272

Post by alimw » Tue, Jan 10, 2017, 8:53 PM UTC

Question1101 wrote: post #233

I think being able to draw would really make me happy but I just can't make it through those countless hours of deliberate practice I would need to put in before I can produce any worthwhile art.

That's crazy talk. How good would you have to be before your work was "worthwhile" enough to make you happy?

Re: When You Are Depressed, Make Something

#273

Post by jackpirate » Tue, Jan 10, 2017, 8:58 PM UTC

tgb wrote: post #227

jackpirate wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>What? No disease is independent of external factors. This statement is true only in the narrowest sense and is actively harmful to people with mental health issues. Let's compare depression and cancer to see why. It is common to say something like "cancer is independent of external factors" to mean that anyone can get cancer. It doesn't matter how healthy of a lifestyle you live. Due to random chance, the guy who re…

No one feels ashamed of seeking treatment for pneumonia, but there's no way you would say it's independent of external factors. That depression is affected by external factors should neither be controversial nor related to your concerns about society's acceptance of its treatment. You seem to be conflating "dependent on external factors" with "arises due to bad life decisions", which is bizarre as it's kinda the exac…

In a strictly clinical discussion it is fine to use language like "dependent on external factors" with its technical meaning. But when you're talking to someone potentially suffering from depression and not a clinician, you need to be aware of how they will respond to your words. The average person conflates "dependent on external factors" with "arises due to bad life decisions" and so we need to adapt our language accordingly in an average conversation.

Re: When You Are Depressed, Make Something

#274

Post by md224 » Tue, Jan 10, 2017, 9:02 PM UTC

EGreg wrote: post #245

hathawsh wrote: post #155

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Most mainstream Judaeo-Christian postulates the immortality of the soul. But it seems to come up against mainstream history and science." Does it? Science does not answer questions that defy empirical inquiry. I have been told that we are spirits first and that we are having a temporary in-body experience. We don't currently remember our time before because this period of our eternal existence is a special test. It'…

I mean like for example the archaeology and genetic tracing of native americans building cities 5000 years ago, Egyptian pyramids built 4500 years ago, vs the story that everything on earth got wiped out by a giant flood 4100 years ago. They can't both be true. Similarly if the Exodus happened Egypt would have been devastated and overrun by Hittites etc. Or Herod's killing of all the children. Or the mass resurrectio…

I think it's more productive to look at the question of consciousness and immortality outside the context of religious doctrines and narratives. Religion provides answers to this question, as does Science, but they don't exhaust all of the possibilities. There's a deeper epistemological issue here about what we know about consciousness and what we can say with certainty about first-person experience.

Re: When You Are Depressed, Make Something

#275

Post by komali2 » Tue, Jan 10, 2017, 9:04 PM UTC

Broken_Hippo wrote: post #226

cpncrunch wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Those techniques are what you called "short term solutions." I think of them as long-term preventative measures to stave off the chemical imbalance that can cause depression What causes the chemical imbalances? Research on animals show that chronic stress causes depression, so it definitely can be caused by external factors. If your job is causing chronic stress then changing job is obviously a plausible cure for yo…

To do that, you actually have to both be actually able to find and take a different job plus have the clarity to know that such a thing will improve your situation. And with depression (or anxiety), this isn't so easy. It gets difficult to see opportunities and easier to blame yourself, thinking, "I'm lucky to have this crappy job and that they put up with me". It can make your job seem crappy, even when it isn't. I…

>before the darkness sets in and messes with your sensors

I like this language, "messes with your sensors." Depression is a disease within the brain, and naturally it's difficult to observe a system from within that system - especially when those observational tools are affected by the system itself.

So it's really hard to know you have depression and take the steps to treat it, when you have depression.

Re: When You Are Depressed, Make Something

#276

Post by komali2 » Tue, Jan 10, 2017, 9:06 PM UTC

cpncrunch wrote: post #217

rapfaria wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really a cure, but a necessity. You still need treatment.

It depends. My own depression was completely cured by lifestyle changes, as was my wife's (different causes for each, but mostly related to jobs).

Treatment doesn't have to be medication or therapy, as I said in my post I consider exercise, meditation, and mindset modifications to be forms of treatment. It's certainly how I handle upticks in depression now that I don't medicate anymore.

Re: When You Are Depressed, Make Something

#277

Post by jrs235 » Tue, Jan 10, 2017, 9:08 PM UTC

throwaway729 wrote: post #118

Bartweiss wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's a weird divide here. Some people find the innate ability mindset oppressive and saddening, and are greatly comforted by "you can do whatever you set yourself to!" Other people find growth mindset oppressive, and greatly prefer "you can't be the next Gauss, so stop feeling bad about his achievements!" None of which is a strictly relevant to what's true , of course. The answer there seems to be "lots of skill i…

I used to prefer the growth mindset and now I agree with you. I think what changed for me is that I got good enough to regularly interact with people at the "highest levels" of what I do. Teaching probably had some impact on me as well. I still work hard and enjoy improving, but if I'm completely honest with myself, I'll never be as good as some of the people I regularly interact with. Their minds are gifts that no a…

>Maybe ignorance is bliss when it comes to the growth mindset.

"The more you know, the more you know you don't know."

The less you know, the less you know you don't know.

Being a knowledge junkie, ignorance would be bliss. But once you know you can't easily go back and un-know.

Re: When You Are Depressed, Make Something

#278

Post by komali2 » Tue, Jan 10, 2017, 9:08 PM UTC

spangry wrote: post #162

komali2 wrote: post #117

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I completely disagree with you. I believe you are describing solutions to problems that can make someone sad or frustrated, which is a fine thing. I'm all about being real about your life situation and doing something about it. However, depression is a disease independent of external factors. I had it when I had arguably one of the coolest jobs in my life up until that point. I treated it with medication, got out of…

I think the observations in your last paragraph are very wise. I've recently begun to wonder if pursuing 'happiness' is even a useful goal. I'm not really sure what 'happiness' is, or whether it exists. In the past, I have conflated transitory 'ups' in my life, caused by external factors, with sustainable and lasting happiness. When those external factors change, as they always do, it never seems to end well. But it'…

Happiness for me can be just as much reflecting on the awesome things that have happened to me in the past, and where I am now, as much as it can be looking forward to the future.

I don't think there's something wrong with setting "happiness" as a goal - I think the important thing is separating that goal from other ones. So not attaching "achieving happiness" to "when I get a raise," instead just looking at internal things you can do to "be happy" in whatever situation.

But exercise, good diet, and not being in a stressful situation does help.

Re: When You Are Depressed, Make Something

#279

Post by whenwillitstop » Tue, Jan 10, 2017, 9:16 PM UTC

ars wrote: post #191

sixo wrote: post #80

When you are depressed, see if there's a serious problem in your life that is causing you to be depressed and devote as much time and energy as you can muster towards exploring solutions to that problem, even if they entail dramatic life-changing decisions, because that's the kind of problem we're dealing with here. Examples of such problems: you hate your graduate program. You have no friends in your city and no ide…

> When you are depressed, see if there's a serious problem in your life that is causing you to be depressed You are under the common delusion that depression is caused by something in a person's life/environment. This is NOT TRUE! Depression is often caused by nothing whatsoever. Someone is simply depressed with absolutely no reason at all. Depression that is caused by something is not strictly depression, it is a se…

Right but your assertion here is completely unfounded. It is a theory. Quantifying that nothing in someones life (or their past) is causing them depression is near impossible. This charade is completely scientifically unprovable.

Edit: changed the word sadness to depression.

Re: When You Are Depressed, Make Something

#280

Post by NathanCH » Tue, Jan 10, 2017, 9:23 PM UTC

TheOneTrueKyle wrote: post #161

empath75 wrote: post #15

As someone who has periodic depressive episodes, if you're capable of leaving the house to go to a DJ class, you're probably already over the worst of it. "Just go do x" sort of has a "Get off the couch" pre-requisite that needs to be satisfied.

Yeah, but getting off the couch is the hardest part

It's the easiest part technically.