Vivaldi – A Browser for Our Friends • Hacker News Board

Re: Vivaldi – A Browser for Our Friends

#101

Post by grzm » Fri, Jan 06, 2017, 10:32 AM UTC

SyneRyder wrote: post #98

grzm wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My tiny email list (at indieconference.com) has 8% of my subscribers using Apple Mail, and 75% still use desktop/laptop for checking email. Does this breakdown take into account the OS? Is that 8% of macOS subscribers running Apple Mail, or of all subscribers? I'm unfamiliar with what data you have avialable, so I'm not sure if this is even possible. Thanks for the link to emailclientmarketshare.com. As you noted, Ap…

Oh, I meant 8% of all subscribers use Apple Mail. It isn't 8% of macOS users, but 8% of any device. So the percentage of Mac users with Apple Mail would be higher than 8%. You could try calculating something similar with the Email Client Marketshare figures: remove all the iPhone / iPad / Android / Windows clients and calculate from what's left. If I do that I estimate 15 - 20% of macOS folks using Apple Mail, with t…

That's what I suspected. Thanks for confirming!

Re: Vivaldi – A Browser for Our Friends

#102

Post by Aoyagi » Fri, Jan 06, 2017, 10:37 AM UTC

Al-Khwarizmi wrote: post #91

As an old Opera user I really want to like Vivaldi, but the weird titlebar without title and especially the non-native menubar really turn me off (in a native menubar under Windows, once you click a menu, you can just move your mouse without clicking to navigate the rest of the menus. In Vivaldi's menubar, you can't, making the menus way clunkier to navigate). For this reason, I actually find the experience of Otter…

I was asking for a proper native title bar possibly a year ago since I'm using the "classic" Windows theme and that's just ideal. It doesn't take up much space and it shows the whole page title.

http://puu.sh/tcYJ7/b7479e05cd.png

Re: Vivaldi – A Browser for Our Friends

#103

Post by anw » Fri, Jan 06, 2017, 10:41 AM UTC

I've used Vivaldi as my primary (Chrome as secondary) browser the past 3 months (along using Vivaldi.net as my e-mail address – thank you for offering this, Vivaldi team).

I love the browser so far, and think it deserves many accolades for what it has and is attempting to accomplish. I do run into the occasional issues that remind me this is a newer browser, though. Mostly these are only noticeable because they completely break your concentration from what you were doing.

For instance, if you attempt to bookmark the current page but realize you want to put it in a new folder, then you'll have to break your flow of bookmarking by going to the Bookmarks page, create the folder, then go back to page again to add it to the newly created folder.

Right-clicking on a link and opening in a new tab will immediately take you to that new tab, even if you wanted to save it for after you finished the current page. There may be a chrome setting for this, but a cursory glance at the preferences window didn't show any kind of wording that would indicate "open new tab in background".

The only main gripe I really have is in retrieving saved passwords. Yes, I can put the URL directly into the bar and go there that way, but it's an inconvenience I don't have to deal with in Chrome (or Firefox).

Even with these few issues, Vivaldi has been my favorite browser these past months, and I can't wait to see how it matures.

Re: Vivaldi – A Browser for Our Friends

#104

Post by Aoyagi » Fri, Jan 06, 2017, 10:42 AM UTC

StevePerkins wrote: post #46

I check in on Vivaldi every few months to see how it's coming along, and there are some things that I like. However, I think they're a bit TOO fixated on Opera as it was 15 years ago. I keep waiting for bookmark sync, which today is a fundamental browser feature rather than a nice-to-have. But the Vivaldi guys insist on pouring resources into an integrated desktop email client instead, because that was a signature fe…

>I just don't WANT a re-implementation of Opera from 15 years ago. I'm sorry, but desktop email is dead for most of us.

Well, those "most of you" clearly are not the target audience. And you're not the majority either, I should add.

Sounds like you just want Chrome, to be frank.

Re: Vivaldi – A Browser for Our Friends

#105

Post by Aoyagi » Fri, Jan 06, 2017, 10:47 AM UTC

fredoralive wrote: post #89

Vivaldi is frustrating, as it nearly implements all the bits of Opera I use, but there are odd bits where it falls short The main thing for me is the fact that tab minimisation doesn't work correctly, sometimes tabs you've minimised get selected, sometimes even when there are unminimised tabs. It's just wrong, and the tab handling was one of the main reasons I used Opera Beyond that there's a lack of a bookmark menu,…

One of the most frustrating things for me is the lack of Dragonfly...

Re: Vivaldi – A Browser for Our Friends

#106

Post by Aoyagi » Fri, Jan 06, 2017, 10:51 AM UTC

ymse wrote: post #66

vortico wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm wondering this too. Mozilla has tons of sponsorship from Yahoo and others. Google invests in Chrome to give them leverage for their own products. Since Vivaldi is closed source, how do I know they aren't selling my data?

Vivaldi is allegedly free software: https://vivaldi.com/source/

AFAIK that's only a part of it, specifically the layout engine-related one.

Re: Vivaldi – A Browser for Our Friends

#107

Post by m45t3r » Fri, Jan 06, 2017, 11:02 AM UTC

tornadoboy55 wrote: post #54

gkya wrote: post #13

I could've given it a try if it was opensource. But because it's closed I immediately classify it as vaporware, and as the browser is one of the two centers of my daily computing (the other being emacs), I won't invest in vaporware. I believe that opensourcing is the best choice of the company behind this.

> Closed source = vaporware Then why has Firefox been the 'shit' browser for the better part of a decade now? Best battery life (usually by a 2-4h difference!) -> use Edge/Safari Best stability -> use Chrome Best performance -> use Blink-based browser Most extensions -> use Firefox (Chrome has 90% of the FF extensions available though) Hell, Firefox still doesn't have e10s fully working, so one tab takes down the ent…

Low memory usage is a Firefox win at least, partially because they don't have true multi process yet.

I would gladly switch to Firefox on my dev machine (opening both Photoshop, Visual Studio and Chrome in a 8GB RAM system is a recipe to disaster), if their development tools didn't suck.

Re: Vivaldi – A Browser for Our Friends

#108

Post by m45t3r » Fri, Jan 06, 2017, 11:05 AM UTC

dchest wrote: post #87

Sir_Cmpwn wrote: post #51

No source, no deal.

There's this: https://vivaldi.com/source/ (don't know what's inside)

AFAIK, this is mostly Chromium and their patches. The interface itself (that is mostly build in something similar to Electron, i.e. JavaScript, CSS and HTML) is completely closed source.

Re: Vivaldi – A Browser for Our Friends

#109

Post by tomw2005 » Fri, Jan 06, 2017, 11:07 AM UTC

Al-Khwarizmi wrote: post #91

As an old Opera user I really want to like Vivaldi, but the weird titlebar without title and especially the non-native menubar really turn me off (in a native menubar under Windows, once you click a menu, you can just move your mouse without clicking to navigate the rest of the menus. In Vivaldi's menubar, you can't, making the menus way clunkier to navigate). For this reason, I actually find the experience of Otter…

> I encourage old Opera fans to check it out as well.

Did something happen to Opera to make it lose fans? I tried it a long time ago (pre-Chrome) and enjoyed it then but eventually ended up on Chrome. Are there any particular criticisms of the current version of Opera?

Re: Vivaldi – A Browser for Our Friends

#110

Post by bigbugbag » Fri, Jan 06, 2017, 11:08 AM UTC

ymse wrote: post #66

vortico wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm wondering this too. Mozilla has tons of sponsorship from Yahoo and others. Google invests in Chrome to give them leverage for their own products. Since Vivaldi is closed source, how do I know they aren't selling my data?

Vivaldi is allegedly free software: https://vivaldi.com/source/

No. no it's not. see vivaldi://about/

Vivaldi Technologies AS. A Browser For Our Friends Copyright 2017 Vivaldi Technologies AS. All rights reserved. Vivaldi is made possible by the Chromium open source project and other open source software. Vivaldi Terms of Service

and vivaldi://terms

Vivaldi End User License Agreement

Last updated: November 18, 2016 1. This End User License Agreement ("EULA") governs your use ("You") of the browser software in executable form ("Software") and any ancillary services ("Services") provided to You by Vivaldi Technology AS ("Vivaldi") to the exclusion of all other terms and conditions. Source code used in the Software, under open source license agreements, can be obtained at https://vivaldi.com/source. (...)