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The Reality of Developer Burnout

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Re: The Reality of Developer Burnout

#131

Post by tuxxy »

ekidd wrote: post #93
aaron-lebo wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone who is feeling more and more contrarian lately in my comments here and regretting it, I think it's because after a decade of HN, everything starts to the look the same. Everybody is trying to sell a framework, a startup, a language, or their own personal brand and it turns into a big circlejerk of everyone patting themselves on the back because they've got some secret knowledge. Sometimes it doesn't seem l…

> Should you replace your C codebase with Rust... or Go? Handy sanity tip: If your question begins "Should you replace your ____ codebase?", you can automatically answer "No." If you're really starting to hate your codebase, you're allowed to rewrite one module using a new tech stack, but only if that tech stack seems uniquely well suited to the task at hand. Maybe it will suck. Maybe it won't. If it doesn't suck, yo…

That's a really good measure. Thanks!

Re: The Reality of Developer Burnout

#132

Post by RockyMcNuts »

relics443 wrote: post #130

TL;DR I experienced massive burnout after ridiculous working hours and a broken contract I experienced terrible burnout around a year ago that I'm still working to get over. I had taken a pay cut to join a startup with the promise (contractually) that I receive a raise to market value + bonus after 12 months. The latter 6 of those months were spent working 16 hour days ramping up to a massive launch. There were multi…

nah, you definitely have some other folks to blame, like the ones who reneged on contractual obligations. yikers. and there's a lot to unpack, but I'd definitely talk to a lawyer, and some kind of therapist/counselor. now go to http://thenicestplaceontheinter.net/

Re: The Reality of Developer Burnout

#133

Post by aaronscott »

debt wrote: post #78
1_2__3 wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're actually making the issue worse by conflating burnout with simple... I guess laziness? In fact the whole reason why burnout is such a fascinating phenomenon is because it takes otherwise highly productivity people who do not hate their job and turns them into minimal-productivity people who do hate their jobs. That's nothing at all like you're describing.

So people who love their jobs can also burn out? I don't buy it. Personally, I've never heard of or met anyone who loves their job and has burned out. Have you?

I've experienced this first hand. It's a surreal feeling, because you know that objectively everything is awesome, but emotionally you want to throw it all away.

I have also experienced burn out with a job that I disliked. In both cases there is a feeling of not being able to focus on the work at hand, that more effort will make you physically sick.

The author's example of eating ice cream at every meal resonates with me really well. You do get tired of it, even if it's conceptually amazing.

Re: The Reality of Developer Burnout

#134

Post by jdc »

maverick_iceman wrote: post #99
user837387 wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

HN is full of contrarians. Say anything blunt, not rude but blunt, and you will get down-voted to oblivion. And not even that, say something in a polite way that people cannot discredit but still not like and you will get down-voted. I feel like you have to mold yourself to the hive mind if you want your stuff to be up-voted. Not sure if this is really how it is or if it is just me. On the other hand, a lot of times…

I always wonder why people care so much about getting downvoted. I get downvoted all the time but who cares, these votes are just some meaningless statistic.

Thanks for the reminder.

Re: The Reality of Developer Burnout

#135

Post by relics443 »

RockyMcNuts wrote: post #132
relics443 wrote: post #130

TL;DR I experienced massive burnout after ridiculous working hours and a broken contract I experienced terrible burnout around a year ago that I'm still working to get over. I had taken a pay cut to join a startup with the promise (contractually) that I receive a raise to market value + bonus after 12 months. The latter 6 of those months were spent working 16 hour days ramping up to a massive launch. There were multi…

nah, you definitely have some other folks to blame, like the ones who reneged on contractual obligations. yikers. and there's a lot to unpack, but I'd definitely talk to a lawyer, and some kind of therapist/counselor. now go to http://thenicestplaceontheinter.net/

I eventually got the money (a few months later), and they had enough decency to keep me on payroll while I was incapacitated. I believe they learned their lesson, and have made serious gestures to show that. But the damage is still done.

Re: The Reality of Developer Burnout

#136

Post by rdavl »

dvtv75 wrote: post #114
rdavl wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am saying depression is caused by large variety of factors and not just coding, if you have personal problems you will burnt out cos of them, and that will affect your coding, you can't blame software development for that. Also unless you are doing really stressful work what is it that makes you burn out? Maybe you have other interests? Not wanting to code all day every day does not mean you have burnt out. Also th…

Having burned out a number of times, I think that perhaps you would benefit greatly from investigating what burn out actually is, and the causes of it, rather than making broad assumptions about it. For instance, burn-out has less to do with what you are doing, and more to do with the stress and effort required. It doesn't matter if you're disarming bombs ("bomb technician," huh?) or grading freshman assignments. Wha…

> Having burned out a number of times

So this more like a being sick of doing things temporarily?

What you are doing and the effort you have to put in is what puts stress on you isn't it?

> ("bomb technician," huh?)

Huh what? Wrong term? Are you seriously saying that job that puts your life in danger causes the same amount of stress as grading papers? Sure, grading papers can take effort, but come on... That is just plain wrong... Have you ever been in life or death situation? Not much compares to it...

If your employer demands near-impossible targets and you are aware of this and not living in the country where it is impossible to find another job you are the fault.

Maybe I am seem like arrogant arse but you seem like you are totally disconnected from reality.

Re: The Reality of Developer Burnout

#137

Post by rdavl »

danso wrote: post #61
rdavl wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am saying depression is caused by large variety of factors and not just coding, if you have personal problems you will burnt out cos of them, and that will affect your coding, you can't blame software development for that. Also unless you are doing really stressful work what is it that makes you burn out? Maybe you have other interests? Not wanting to code all day every day does not mean you have burnt out. Also th…

> Also the words "burnt out" sounds like one those buzz words people come up to feel like more special snow flakes... I dunno, based on his accomplishments and how much I rely on his work on a daily basis, I consider the OP to be a special snowflake if snowflakes exist.

True, I also use his work, and I am not saying he personally is a bad person, but these burn out posts come so often lately that it makes me wonder if people even know any definition of it.

Quick google search tells me this: > ruin one's health or become completely exhausted through overwork.

And the only thing the post saysis

> It happens to everyone that writes code all day long — the sudden feeling of "I'd rather do anything else than this right now" — even though writing software is one of your favorite activities in the world.

This is not burn out... I'd rather do something else does not mean your health is ruined from overwork... But maybe I am just nitpicking...

Re: The Reality of Developer Burnout

#138

Post by rdavl »

dwaltrip wrote: post #54
rdavl wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am saying depression is caused by large variety of factors and not just coding, if you have personal problems you will burnt out cos of them, and that will affect your coding, you can't blame software development for that. Also unless you are doing really stressful work what is it that makes you burn out? Maybe you have other interests? Not wanting to code all day every day does not mean you have burnt out. Also th…

> Also unless you are doing really stressful work what is it that makes you burn out? I think you are making too many assumptions about what kind of work and what work environments are stressful for different people. Could the term "burn out" be abused? Of course, it's something that is difficult for others to verify. That fact doesn't make it less real for those actually experiencing it.

Maybe I am, but really stressful environments are stressful for everyone.

If you are unable to cope with some levels of stress it is not the coding that is the problem, it is you. Or do we just go around blaming everything else for our problems?

Should I blame you or me for my karma score? Come on...

Re: The Reality of Developer Burnout

#139

Post by JTenerife »

I've had several periods in my career where I "felt" like I just couldn't get things done. Some weeks ago, I faced panic attacks and anxiety for the first time of my life due to unmanageable workload combine with nastiest politics going on a my workplace.

This actually changed it for me. I still feel fear that I'm broken permanently.

So, yes, another anecdote. Everyone just needs to really take care by managing themselfes. Working fixed hours only instead of trying to get features by the end of the day / week has done did it for me.

Re: The Reality of Developer Burnout

#140

Post by [deleted] »

treehau5 wrote: post #33
zoeysaurusrex wrote: post #6

> Not only that, but I found myself censoring my own private thought processes, in the silent comfort of my own home, because of the public opinion of people I follow on Twitter. I deleted my Twitter account because of this. I realized it was an empty echo chamber of inaction. If anything you say can be interpreted in a way that the hivemind can destroy you over, they will do it, even with incomplete information and…

It takes 10x the amount of energy to refute bs than to create it

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