Ask HN: What “old” programming languages will you still be using in 2017? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: What “old” programming languages will you still be using in 2017?

#471

Post by thijsvandien » Wed, Jan 04, 2017, 6:27 PM UTC

dejv wrote: post #428

thijsvandien wrote: post #351

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not unsurprisingly, I'd much recommend getting rid of Paradox. For my projects (several 100KLOCs, most of it DB-related) I relatively easily migrated to Firebird with IBObjects ( http://www.ibobjects.com – not affiliated), both of which have been a major success.

Migrating db is on my list all 9 years I am working on project, but I still havent find a way to do it. Core of the problem is stupid idea that paradox tables are actually files, so there are tons of copying and moving files around instead of using paradox as db. Given the complexity of project and our budget it will have to stay.

You make me want see it and really not want to see it at the same time. :)

Re: Ask HN: What “old” programming languages will you still be using in 2017?

#472

Post by vram22 » Wed, Jan 04, 2017, 6:29 PM UTC

noonespecial wrote: post #7

Pascal/Delphi Before there was an internet of lightbulbs and smoke detectors, there was an internet of industrial process things. And they used windows 2000 and Delphi. They still do.

>And they used windows 2000 and Delphi. They still do.

Ha ha, good one.

There was this interesting thread on Delphi a while ago on HN:

Delphi – why won't it die? (2013 (stevepeacocke.blogspot.com)

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=7613543

Re: Ask HN: What “old” programming languages will you still be using in 2017?

#473

Post by sebastianconcpt » Wed, Jan 04, 2017, 6:33 PM UTC

i_feel_great wrote: post #369

sebastianconcpt wrote: post #336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is not a Windows app, is a server microservice so I have to discard my favorite Dolphin Smalltalk for the remarkable Pharo or Squeak. Since is a business thing that will run on some linux server, I think that we'll go for Pharo. To be honest at this point Gemstone is not discarded, but geez I wish would be easier to do devops with it. A good how-to from zero to hero on a basic gemstone dev setup and minimal productio…

Dolphin is a very nice Smalltalk. For business, local clients all use Windows and do not trust web apps for core applications. So Dolphin + ODBC is my latest go to for business apps.

Ha! this is good news. I've got Dolphin Smalltalk running on macOS https://twitter.com/sebastianconcpt/status/81670666334446796...

Re: Ask HN: What “old” programming languages will you still be using in 2017?

#474

Post by hprotagonist » Wed, Jan 04, 2017, 6:36 PM UTC

m_mueller wrote: post #427

chestervonwinch wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMO, it's more than not awful , it's great! I wish I had picked it up sooner as a mid-level language for mathematical and scientific computing (over C++). Additionally, you can connect Fortran to Python dead simple with `f2py`.

IMO the ongoing trend of moving everything academic to C++ is just awful. I still don't get why everything thinks a language-to-rule-them-all is what should be used by default, especially in the age of LLVM. IMO Alan Kay and his research group has always had exactly the right ideas in this regard. I think iPython/Jupyter + Numpy + some kind of JITed Fortran 2008 environment with accelerator support would be a nearly…

this is how my field is going. (biomedical/neurosci). Of course, since numpy is effectively a nice shell on top of linpack, my original assertion still holds.

Re: Ask HN: What “old” programming languages will you still be using in 2017?

#475

Post by sdegutis » Wed, Jan 04, 2017, 8:44 PM UTC

yoz-y wrote: post #454

_vya7 wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Meh, I've spent about 20 hours on this project so far, and I'd estimate probably 2 minutes of that time was spent managing .h files.

Do you have any concerns about maintainability? So far Apple has been advancing Obj-C interfaces along with Swift, but time will probably come when some new OS features will only be available through Swift.

Nope. See gurkendoktor's reply to me above. I agree with his/her reasoning.

Re: Ask HN: What “old” programming languages will you still be using in 2017?

#476

Post by LyndsySimon » Wed, Jan 04, 2017, 10:00 PM UTC

Insanity wrote: post #212

stinkytaco wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I find that clear notetaking is amazing in guiding discussions. Being the one who sends out the meeting summary with next actions and clarifying remarks or being able to refer back to meeting notes gives me an amazing power in making decisions or resolving disputes. Just because I'm the one who's writing stuff down, I'm somehow given the authority to say "this is what we decided at the meeting".

Absolutely! Can I ask if you are taking these nodes the old fashioned way with pen and paper or are you using a program to do this? I myself have found out that during meetings I prefer to use a pen and paper but it is mostly just notes that I take for myself.

I've found that the more attention I pay to my notes, the better I recall the topic at hand even without referring to the notes I've taken.

As a result I exclusively use pen-and-paper for meetings. I also started using fountain pens about two years ago and the discipline required to write well, especially with vintage flexible nib pens, helps keep me focused on note-taking.

Re: Ask HN: What “old” programming languages will you still be using in 2017?

#477

Post by Gracana » Wed, Jan 04, 2017, 10:04 PM UTC

snowwindwaves wrote: post #354

Gracana wrote: post #26

IEC61131-3 family.. very widely used stuff, but definitely feels clunky and old. It's not even fun-retro-old, it's just old-old. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IEC_61131-3

I have no complaints with these languages. I have only seen them used to program PLCs to control machines and processes, and the simplicity of the languages keeps programs simple and straightforward too. What features are missing that you think belong in process control?

The languages aren't so bad, but the ecosystem is rough. On the PLC vendor side, implementations vary widely and they're all proprietary, so for a given controller... what they give you is all you get. On the programmer side, skills vary widely and ladder logic is the common denominator, so a lot more is written in ladder logic than is appropriate. For instance... Complex sequential logic (like a machine with many adjustable operations, all controlled by an HMI) is difficult to convey clearly in a ladder logic program. It can be done... but all I have ever encountered is lots and lots of spaghetti logic.

I wish I could use sequential function charts to handle some of the complexity in the machines I work on, but the PLC models we use don't even support them. Argh.

Re: Ask HN: What “old” programming languages will you still be using in 2017?

#478

Post by sigjuice » Thu, Jan 05, 2017, 1:10 AM UTC

tonyarkles wrote: post #363

_pfxa wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's such a nice UI paradigm married to a decent lisp (any lisp is better than no lisp :)). Once you get the actual hang of it you can't ever leave it. Just like real coffee vs. instant abominations.

Any recommendations for a good starter guide? I've done some lisp here and there, a bit of Clojure, and some other FP-style things (e.g. Elixir). I'm not scared by parens :). I'm just not sure where to start with elisp and getting into a good groove with it. Edit: also a long-term Emacs convert, just haven't written any of the elisp myself.

I would suggest starting off by reading the first few chapters of the official elisp manual https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/manual/elisp.html and experimenting as you go along.

Re: Ask HN: What “old” programming languages will you still be using in 2017?

#479

Post by SAI_Peregrinus » Thu, Jan 05, 2017, 1:42 AM UTC

VHDL & Verilog. 29 and 30 years old respectively, and while not really programming languages (they're hardware description languages) but they're used quite a bit. Any piece of equipment with an FPGA or CPLD inside (more things than you'd expect) and for prototyping systems before going to the expense of creating custom ICs. While they're not as old as many of the other languages mentioned here they're old enough, and I haven't seen anyone else mentioning them.

Re: Ask HN: What “old” programming languages will you still be using in 2017?

#480

Post by yawaramin » Thu, Jan 05, 2017, 3:44 AM UTC

pjmlp wrote: post #157

yawaramin wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's funny because Anders Hejlsberg was the chief architect of both Delphi and C#.

Hence why I consider a big error to have created the CLR in first place. Now we kind of got .NET Native, but it still isn't 100% done.

Sometimes I fantasise about what would've happened if MS had decided, by some fluke, to push, say, OCaml as their big .Net initiative. Can you imagine MS Visual OCaml#? OCaml for Windows app development ... that would've turned some heads.