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Thursday = Thor's day

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Re: Thursday = Thor's day

#161

Post by char »

ErrantX wrote: post #95
VictorHo wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm merely pointing to the fact that many extremely intelligent individuals have given atheism a lot of thought and come out on both sides of the fence. Of all major world issues, topics of study, etc., I cannot think of another with bigger potential implications. Your statement that "religious belief should be an individual thing" is exactly the mindset that I am trying to address. The existence of a God is fact, or…

Saying something is "individual" is healthy only to the point that it does not stop you from actually researching it That's the point I am disagreeing with though. The problem with God is that there is no way we can consider it as a Fact or Non-Fact. There is currently no objective reality of God's existence - so there is no element of fact or non-fact in it (interesting side note: if we all unequivocally believe in…

"The problem with God is that there is no way we can consider it as a Fact or Non-Fact. There is currently no objective reality of God's existence - so there is no element of fact or non-fact in it."

The same can be said for unicorns and garden gnomes. Except that an overwhelming majority of people consider it a Fact that those creatures don't exist.

Re: Thursday = Thor's day

#162

Post by twp »

huherto wrote: post #143
mixmax wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a very typical religious argument. It puts religion, in this case Christianity, on a piedestal where it doesn't belong if you don't happen to be Christian. The original statement in it's logic form is this: You believe in 530 gods, I believe in 529 gods. 530 minus 529 is 1, so we agree on not believing in most of the gods. That's it. Nothing more to it. And assuming the date didn't secretly worship Zeus it's…

But it seems an awful way to dismiss the discussion on a date. Comparing the belief in Christ with the belief in Zeus!? I know it may be logical for an atheist, but for a Christian it may actually be insulting.

> Comparing the belief in Christ with the belief in Zeus ... for a Christian it may actually be insulting?

Why? Why the double standards? We both find belief in Zeus ridiculous. What's fundamentally different about the Christian God in 2000 AD and the Greek God in 0AD? What statement can you make that is valid for the Christian God but is plainly ridiculous when you replace the word "God" with the word "Zeus"?

Re: Thursday = Thor's day

#163

Post by nske »

hugh3 wrote: post #24
huherto wrote: post #7

Interesting. Knowing a little bit of English/Spanish you can guess the origin of most of the days of the week. * Sunday/Domingo - Sun/? * Monday/Lunes - Moon/Luna * Tuesday/Martes - ?/Mars * Wednesday/Miercoles - ?/Mercurio * Thursday/Jueves - Thor/Jupiter * Friday/Viernes - ?/Venus * Saturday/Sabado - Saturn/?

What's really interesting is that Portugese is one of the few European languages which doesn't follow this pattern, since at some point someone decided it was heretical to name days after those silly Pagan gods. So they have: * Domingo – Sunday * Segunda-feira – Monday * Terça-feira – Tuesday * Quarta-feira – Wednesday * Quinta-feira – Thursday * Sexta-feira – Friday * Sábado – Saturday Domingo is the Day of the Lord…

In greek it is rather similar:

  * Monday -> Δευτέρα ("second")
  * Tuesday -> Τρίτη("third")
  * Wednesday -> Τετάρτη ("fourth")
  * Thursday -> Πέμπτη ("fifth")
  * Friday -> Παρασκευή ("preperation")
  * Saturday -> Σάββατο ("sabbath")
  * Sunday -> Κυριακή ("of the lord)
That version is being used since the time of the Roman Empire, before that, Greeks used the babylonian model that named days after planets -which in turn had been named after gods.

The english names are of germanic/norse descent, again mostly names of gods.

Re: Thursday = Thor's day

#164

Post by VMG »

huherto wrote: post #143
mixmax wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a very typical religious argument. It puts religion, in this case Christianity, on a piedestal where it doesn't belong if you don't happen to be Christian. The original statement in it's logic form is this: You believe in 530 gods, I believe in 529 gods. 530 minus 529 is 1, so we agree on not believing in most of the gods. That's it. Nothing more to it. And assuming the date didn't secretly worship Zeus it's…

But it seems an awful way to dismiss the discussion on a date. Comparing the belief in Christ with the belief in Zeus!? I know it may be logical for an atheist, but for a Christian it may actually be insulting.

..as is your belief to a hindu

Re: Thursday = Thor's day

#165

Post by huherto »

twp wrote: post #162
huherto wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it seems an awful way to dismiss the discussion on a date. Comparing the belief in Christ with the belief in Zeus!? I know it may be logical for an atheist, but for a Christian it may actually be insulting.

> Comparing the belief in Christ with the belief in Zeus ... for a Christian it may actually be insulting? Why? Why the double standards? We both find belief in Zeus ridiculous. What's fundamentally different about the Christian God in 2000 AD and the Greek God in 0AD? What statement can you make that is valid for the Christian God but is plainly ridiculous when you replace the word "God" with the word "Zeus"?

because Christians are people too...they have feelings.

I am not arguing that the Christian God is more logical than Zeus. But be careful to bring it up on date if you don't want to end up in an argument like this one. Respect the religious beliefs of other people because they are important for them.

Re: Thursday = Thor's day

#166

Post by btilly »

nopassrecover wrote: post #14
huherto wrote: post #7

Interesting. Knowing a little bit of English/Spanish you can guess the origin of most of the days of the week. * Sunday/Domingo - Sun/? * Monday/Lunes - Moon/Luna * Tuesday/Martes - ?/Mars * Wednesday/Miercoles - ?/Mercurio * Thursday/Jueves - Thor/Jupiter * Friday/Viernes - ?/Venus * Saturday/Sabado - Saturn/?

The French I was taught in primary school hinted at most of this too. I'd venture anyone who knew bits of different languages would have probably guessed the roots of the days, atlhough English roots differ from romance roots (Wednesday based on the English god Woden instead of the Roman god Mercury). * Dimanche * Lundi * Mardi * Mercredi * Jeudi * Vendredi * Samedi

Actually if you know enough about the history of the Norse religion, Odin to Mercury is not a difference. Odin comes from Wotan who started as the messenger of the gods then gained prominence in the pantheon. By Roman times he was co-equal with Tiwaz and had acquired many of his characteristics. By Norse times Thor was still important enough to take the central position in the temple at Uppsala. However Odin was god of wars, aristocracy, and poetry. After Christianity took over, Odin continued to gain importance in the mythology (which was after all continued by poets telling stories for aristocracy) and by the time Snorri Sturluson wrote The Prose Edda was the familiar allfather, king of the gods, etc.

Re: Thursday = Thor's day

#167

Post by ErrantX »

ErrantX wrote: post #42
TomOfTTB wrote: post #28

This just makes me sad to be honest with you. The idea that “we believe in 519 out of 520 Gods” means anything shows a fundamental misunderstanding of religion. You may not like the beliefs of some religious people but the point of religion is the beliefs. It’s not that a God created the world it’s that a benevolent God created the world and left teachings which lead to benevolence. On that note I’d point out that he…

I think the point is very simple and very elegant. It's not about God, it's about the fact that humanity (and our history) is a lot more subtle than most people really compute (I came to that realisation myself not very long ago). The beauty of it is that the religious conversation didn't matter too much - it was just that the clever rhetoric device (the Norse gods) was the avenue to a wealth of information. It is th…

No? So Sivers' message was just about religion then? ;)

Re: Thursday = Thor's day

#168

Post by jarek »

VictorHo wrote: post #52
qeorge wrote: post #3

I love that we're living in a time where it's so easy to learn. Well put, Derek. Me too.

I agree with that statement, but it does pain me that this was his big takeaway. There is no decision that is more life-impacting than belief/disbelief in a God. To see someone so quickly silenced/swayed by such simple rhetoric really illustrates how many important subjects are not getting nearly as much thought as they deserve. We will spend months stressing about a job or a start-up, which might affect our lives fo…

> There is no decision that is more life-impacting than belief/disbelief in a god.

There might be a god. Now stop worrying and enjoy your life.

Re: Thursday = Thor's day

#169

Post by char »

VictorHo wrote: post #52
qeorge wrote: post #3

I love that we're living in a time where it's so easy to learn. Well put, Derek. Me too.

I agree with that statement, but it does pain me that this was his big takeaway. There is no decision that is more life-impacting than belief/disbelief in a God. To see someone so quickly silenced/swayed by such simple rhetoric really illustrates how many important subjects are not getting nearly as much thought as they deserve. We will spend months stressing about a job or a start-up, which might affect our lives fo…

"There is no decision that is more life-impacting than belief/disbelief in a god."

Not really. The real life-impacting decision is choosing whether to live for yourself and by your own moral code, or blindly following someone else's.

Re: Thursday = Thor's day

#170

Post by [deleted] »

VMG wrote: post #164
huherto wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it seems an awful way to dismiss the discussion on a date. Comparing the belief in Christ with the belief in Zeus!? I know it may be logical for an atheist, but for a Christian it may actually be insulting.

..as is your belief to a hindu

[deleted]
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