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Facebook’s Face Recognition Tech Goes on Trial

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Re: Facebook’s Face Recognition Tech Goes on Trial

#11

> “We could soon have security cameras in stores that identify people as they shop,” I stopped using Facebook 5 years ago because I noticed using it made me unhappy. I continue to not go back because of privacy concerns like this.

We can already fingerprint digital devices and make pretty good guesses based on purchases and geofencing (leaving the area) whose fingerprint goes to which digital device (especially over repeated visits). I haven't heard of a company that offers this at scale or to cross-reference the information, but I can't imagine it'll take long. It's just a matter of some elbow grease for engineering and the right sales team.

Re: Facebook’s Face Recognition Tech Goes on Trial

#12
How soon before this analysis is being used to cross-reference with terrorist and sexual predator watch-lists causing all sorts of problems for people who happen to closely resemble anyone on those lists?

I'm thinking it's time to buy stock in suppliers of masks, cosmetic surgery and other forms of facial obfuscation.

Re: Facebook’s Face Recognition Tech Goes on Trial

#13
post #11

> “We could soon have security cameras in stores that identify people as they shop,” I stopped using Facebook 5 years ago because I noticed using it made me unhappy. I continue to not go back because of privacy concerns like this.

We can already fingerprint digital devices and make pretty good guesses based on purchases and geofencing (leaving the area) whose fingerprint goes to which digital device (especially over repeated visits). I haven't heard of a company that offers this at scale or to cross-reference the information, but I can't imagine it'll take long. It's just a matter of some elbow grease for engineering and the right sales team.

> I haven't heard of a company that offers this at scale or to cross-reference the information, but I can't imagine it'll take long.

Companies like Acxiom do this: https://liveramp.com/

Re: Facebook’s Face Recognition Tech Goes on Trial

#14
post #12

How soon before this analysis is being used to cross-reference with terrorist and sexual predator watch-lists causing all sorts of problems for people who happen to closely resemble anyone on those lists? I'm thinking it's time to buy stock in suppliers of masks, cosmetic surgery and other forms of facial obfuscation.

[deleted]

Re: Facebook’s Face Recognition Tech Goes on Trial

#15
As someone who had cosmetic surgery, it took a good amount of changes to be tagged as a "different" person by Facebook and the Photos app. One operation that altered the frontal view of the jaw seemed to have finally done the trick (many common operations like rhinoplasty mostly affect your side profile.)

Re: Facebook’s Face Recognition Tech Goes on Trial

#16

> “We could soon have security cameras in stores that identify people as they shop,” I stopped using Facebook 5 years ago because I noticed using it made me unhappy. I continue to not go back because of privacy concerns like this.

Facebook has what they call "shadow profiles" that still track you even if you've never signed up (or deleted your account). Not using Facebook doesn't mean they don't have information on you.

Do you have a source for this? Also, I think it would be considered spying. Facebook, the NSA of the corporate world.

I closed my account 5 yrs ago as well.

Re: Facebook’s Face Recognition Tech Goes on Trial

#17
post #3
post #2

It's good to see that privacy concerns are being voiced publicly. I'm not certain that class-action lawsuits are the most productive approach to take, though. On the technical side, I was intrigued that the "black box" of multilayer neural networks could provide a legal defense for Facebook in this case. Often, the fact that neural networks are harder to analyze compared to other AI techniques is cited as a detriment…

I think because the state law was written about recording the distance between facial features the implementation comes into play. I swear that whole "letter of the law" concept in the US as opposed to the actual intent is frustrating.

There are several competing philosophies of legal interpretation, but (afaik) only one, strict constructionism, wholly disregards intent as a principle.

Usually, the issue is more about whose intent should be considered, and how should that intent be ascertained, than whether or not "the letter of the law" is supreme.

The thing about it is that people are not governed by an ethereal intention that was in the legislature's mind when they crafted the law, because this is undefined and people may have differing opinions about what it is, and because there isn't necessarily a single unifying intention behind the passage of the law; there is only the law that was written, encapsulating the diverse intents of the various parties sufficiently to achieve passage. Assigning more than this enters the realm of speculation.

People do not vote their reps in or out based on their intentions, but on their work product (the laws that get passed and enforced). We do not want judges to be able to say "Yes, I know the law says this, but I think the law really meant this thing that is, in fact, very different."

That's way too much power for a judge, especially considering they're typically appointed, not elected (local judges are sometimes elected). The power of the people via the legislature can easily be neutralized by such actions, and confidence in the judiciary could be seriously harmed by a string of conflicting and contradictory rulings, making people unsure of what's actually legal/safe.

Thus, textualism considers the meaning of the law as written as a whole, and may consult documentation not related to the historical development of the specific legislation at issue, but related to the usage and understanding of words in context at the time that the law was enacted, to approximate what the law (not necessarily the legislature) really meant and how it would've been interpreted by the people who, through their representatives, approved its installation.

One could say this is all technical self-indulgence and that it misses the forest for the trees, and that would pretty well encapsulate the legal industry. ;)

Re: Facebook’s Face Recognition Tech Goes on Trial

#18
From the article it sounds like the result of the lawsuit may be just that facebook adds a disclaimer to their ToS that you accept them using your biometric data by using their service. No surprise there, if you don't want any service collecting any of your data, don't use their service.

Re: Facebook’s Face Recognition Tech Goes on Trial

#19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Facebook has what they call "shadow profiles" that still track you even if you've never signed up (or deleted your account). Not using Facebook doesn't mean they don't have information on you.

Do you have a source for this? Also, I think it would be considered spying. Facebook, the NSA of the corporate world. I closed my account 5 yrs ago as well.

Many sites do this. They encourage users to give full access to their phone's contact list, and store all the data they get from it, then start building a network of "people who know this email address/phone number", ostensibly so that when they finally convince someone to sign up they have a ready-made network of recommended "people you may already know".

Re: Facebook’s Face Recognition Tech Goes on Trial

#20

From the article it sounds like the result of the lawsuit may be just that facebook adds a disclaimer to their ToS that you accept them using your biometric data by using their service. No surprise there, if you don't want any service collecting any of your data, don't use their service.

I would like FB declared a monopoly and broken up or have some sort of data sharing forced on them so that other social networks can pop up.

Network effects cause monopolies. There should be regulation to undo the effects of this sort of monopoly to increase competition in this space. Namely by forced open api and data sharing, so you can take your data to another network if you want to.

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