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No tipping means better business

tastefulventures.com

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Re: No tipping means better business

#511

Post by emodendroket »

randomdata wrote: post #68
colechristensen wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It certainly seems like it should be more efficient for 100 people to eat dinner in a restaurant than for 40 people to cook 100 meals. (100 / average household size (~2.5) = ~40) And yet it's considerably more expensive. Because, it seems, a considerable amount of the cost of restaurant food goes to the overhead costs of the real-estate owners and the financial system. This is both directly and indirectly (the cost o…

> And yet it's considerably more expensive. Even after you've included all of your costs? It's easy to say the raw food ingredients are considerably less expensive, but that's only a small part of the story. There is a cost of having a kitchen (tools and space in the home), utility costs, not to mention your time. Maybe a high end specialty restaurant that is selling an experience, but I'd be surprised if you could a…

...Have you never cooked a meal for yourself or something? Yes, even after accounting for those things, which are amortized over time, the cost of a single meal is not 4+ times the cost of the ingredients. Maybe if you insist on comparing cooking to your hourly wage it starts to look more competitive.

As for McDonald's, well, if you want McDonald's-quality food you can do it cheaper.

Re: No tipping means better business

#512

Post by emodendroket »

kalleboo wrote: post #69
colechristensen wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It certainly seems like it should be more efficient for 100 people to eat dinner in a restaurant than for 40 people to cook 100 meals. (100 / average household size (~2.5) = ~40) And yet it's considerably more expensive. Because, it seems, a considerable amount of the cost of restaurant food goes to the overhead costs of the real-estate owners and the financial system. This is both directly and indirectly (the cost o…

> And yet it's considerably more expensive. Is it? I thought one reason that obesity was higher among people with lower incomes is that it's cheaper for them to buy prepared food than to work an hour less and cook themselves? If I spent the time I did on cooking on paid work instead, the money I would make could pay for a very good meal. (of course, I don't, I still cook because I can't spend every waking hour workin…

That's not exactly it. It's more practical and it's more expensive but not so much more expensive that it's out of reach like better prepared options might be.

Re: No tipping means better business

#513

Post by mikosty »

pc86 wrote: post #202
mikosty wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Add mental strain of thinking should I and how much should I tip. Also hassle if you don't happen to have change readily available. Sometimes it's just easier to go to a place where you don't have to think this.

Mental strain, really?

I'm not a native speaker so 'mental strain' might be a bit overblown expression for this. I'm also from a culture where tipping is not common so for me it's also a cultural difference to deal with.

Re: No tipping means better business

#514

Post by ahh »

Retric wrote: post #486
vostok wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That's just for tax avoidance, those 'bonuses' Can you teach me how this tax avoidance works? It seems that I am missing out. Can you also specify the jurisdiction where this works? > mostly part of their contract I can think of many people whose bonuses are 3x or more their salary and who do not have a guaranteed minimum bonus or even a strict formula based bonus.

http://blog.turbotax.intuit.com/income-and-investments/bonus... 1. The Percentage Method The IRS specifies a flat “supplemental rate” of 25%, meaning that any supplemental wages (including bonuses) should be taxed in that amount. This works for bonuses up to 1 million. > I can think of many people Yes, there are plenty of idiots even in finance.

This only affects the withholding of bonuses (the amount the IRS has you pre-pay as an estimate of taxes.) It does not affect the actual income tax on bonuses.

(It's mostly a disadvantage. I get about 60-70% of my income in bonus and stock which is treated the same; it just means that, if I don't plan ahead for it, I end up with a surprise tax bill on April 15th. I do plan ahead, but the whole process is obnoxious.)

Re: No tipping means better business

#515

Post by ktRolster »

randomdata wrote: post #284
ktRolster wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe a high end specialty restaurant that is selling an experience, but I'd be surprised if you could actually compete with a place like McDonalds on cost. Fries and a hamburger are about the easiest thing to make, requiring no special equipment. The ingredients are a lot cheaper than buying at McDonald's, too. If you have more than one person eating, then the cost savings can really add up.

> Fries and a hamburger are about the easiest thing to make, requiring no special equipment. For all practical purposes of modern urban life, you at least need some kind of specialized heating apparatus. More importantly, somewhere to store that apparatus. Which is quite often a kitchen. In San Francisco, the median housing cost per square foot is almost $1,000. A small kitchen is defined as 70 square feet, or $70,00…

I don't think you can get an apartment without a kitchen.

Re: No tipping means better business

#516

Post by randomdata »

emodendroket wrote: post #511
randomdata wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And yet it's considerably more expensive. Even after you've included all of your costs? It's easy to say the raw food ingredients are considerably less expensive, but that's only a small part of the story. There is a cost of having a kitchen (tools and space in the home), utility costs, not to mention your time. Maybe a high end specialty restaurant that is selling an experience, but I'd be surprised if you could a…

...Have you never cooked a meal for yourself or something? Yes, even after accounting for those things, which are amortized over time, the cost of a single meal is not 4+ times the cost of the ingredients. Maybe if you insist on comparing cooking to your hourly wage it starts to look more competitive. As for McDonald's, well, if you want McDonald's-quality food you can do it cheaper.

> ...Have you never cooked a meal for yourself or something?

No? I try to cook most of my meals. In fact, I prefer it over eating out. I'm not convinced it is fiscally optimal though, but I'm okay with paying the premium for my preference.

> which are amortized over time

Like I pointed out in my other comment, simply having a small kitchen in San Francisco will cost you $2 per meal (assuming you eat three meals per day in it), on average. And that amount per meal goes up if you ever decide to skip a meal or eat away from home on occasion. That is not an insignificant amount when prepared meals are also available in the single digit range.

> Maybe if you insist on comparing cooking to your hourly wage it starts to look more competitive.

If we're talking a programmers wage, you can barely even get into the grocery store before you've accrued enough to pay for several McDonalds meals. Never mind the actual cooking, cleaning, etc. It's not even in the same ballpark of competitiveness. But, like I pointed out in the other comment, even if you only accounted for minimum wage, it barely gives you enough time to serve a meal before it is costing you money.

For a fair analysis, you do have to consider some amount. Maybe not the full amount that you would make at your day job, but something for sure. It is another opportunity cost, after all. If you are not including opportunity cost, you are not painting a true picture.

> As for McDonald's, well, if you want McDonald's-quality food you can do it cheaper.

I wouldn't get too hung up on McDonalds specifically. There are some decent mom and pop joints that will give you a good meal for even less than McDonalds. The point was to exclude $50+ a plate-type places, or whatever, as they are selling an experience that so happens to include food.

Re: No tipping means better business

#517

Post by kevhsu »

dclowd9901 wrote: post #340

It doesn't matter. People will _still_ tip. While the vast majority of us _hate_ tipping, there are some out there who absolutely live by it emotionally (I'm talking about the tippers here), and maintain a healthy amount of guilt if they don't tip. Case in point: One of the biggest wins of Uber was to remove the tip concept from getting a ride. It made the whole experience effortless and seamless. Portland being Port…

Uber drivers are allowed to put up signs soliciting tips in some regions as they won a couple lawsuits.

I choose to tip drivers when they provide extra services or goods. If a driver gives me a bottle of water or lifts heavy luggage for me, I'll sometimes give him some money.

Re: No tipping means better business

#518

Post by randomdata »

ktRolster wrote: post #515
randomdata wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Fries and a hamburger are about the easiest thing to make, requiring no special equipment. For all practical purposes of modern urban life, you at least need some kind of specialized heating apparatus. More importantly, somewhere to store that apparatus. Which is quite often a kitchen. In San Francisco, the median housing cost per square foot is almost $1,000. A small kitchen is defined as 70 square feet, or $70,00…

I don't think you can get an apartment without a kitchen.

Of course, that doesn't mean they are free. There is a very real cost to having the means of production.

Re: No tipping means better business

#519

Post by imron »

logfromblammo wrote: post #346
maccard wrote: post #218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Terrible waiter? Subtract $2 or $3. Really? Surely if they're a terrible waiter/terrible service, you shouldn't leave any tip.

If you plan on leaving a $0 tip, you'd better complain to the manager first.

I come from a country (Australia) where I can always leave a $0 tip, and the server won't mind because they are paid properly by their employer.

I wouldn't leave a $0 tip in a country where tipping is an essential part of the server's income, but I do think such a system is backwards.

Re: No tipping means better business

#520

Post by emodendroket »

randomdata wrote: post #516
emodendroket wrote: post #511

Earlier quoted context omitted.

...Have you never cooked a meal for yourself or something? Yes, even after accounting for those things, which are amortized over time, the cost of a single meal is not 4+ times the cost of the ingredients. Maybe if you insist on comparing cooking to your hourly wage it starts to look more competitive. As for McDonald's, well, if you want McDonald's-quality food you can do it cheaper.

> ...Have you never cooked a meal for yourself or something? No? I try to cook most of my meals. In fact, I prefer it over eating out. I'm not convinced it is fiscally optimal though, but I'm okay with paying the premium for my preference. > which are amortized over time Like I pointed out in my other comment, simply having a small kitchen in San Francisco will cost you $2 per meal (assuming you eat three meals per d…

My point is that if you compare like meals with like meals home cooking is going to be far cheaper just about every time. If you compare cooking a steak to eating eggs and potatoes at a diner maybe not. Restaurants sell just about everything at at least 4 times the cost of the ingredients. The energy and so on aren't exactly free but they're not running a charity either.
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