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Year of Upheaval for Restaurants That Ended Tipping

nytimes.com

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Re: Year of Upheaval for Restaurants That Ended Tipping

#11

Post by lil_cain »

Mao_Zedang wrote: post #5
smallnamespace wrote: post #3

Even if these restaurants succeed, one risk is that 'no tipping' is just something that upscale restaurants in rich areas adopt because only they can afford to. Waiters in those restaurants are already compensated much better than your average waiter on a roadway diner -- this would literally only be helping the already better off.

Or you know just pay people minimum wage at least. I am not sure why certain service based jobs in America attract a tip and some do not.

That article indicates that there are both tipped, and untipped minimum wages - i.e. tipped staff earn less at minimum wage.

Re: Year of Upheaval for Restaurants That Ended Tipping

#12

Post by lil_cain »

argonaut wrote: post #8
rdl wrote: post #7

I don't see why they can't just keep prices the same and add a "mandatory 20% service charge" at the bottom.

According to the article, tips must go only to front house staff by NY state law.

Do service charges count as tips?

Re: Year of Upheaval for Restaurants That Ended Tipping

#13

Post by mahyarm »

smallnamespace wrote: post #10
huhtenberg wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a lot of European countries restaurant tips are completely superficial and not expected, because wait stuff is already properly salaried. This includes all restaurant and cafe sizes.

Yeah, but switching from a tipping to no-tipping equilibrium is probably hard. It's hard for a no-tipping restaurant to compete because the advertised menu prices will simply be higher, and you'd need consumers to mentally adjust all prices ~13% downward. "But some restaurants that adopted a no-tipping policy in 2016 have already revoked it: The New York restaurateurs David Chang, Tom Colicchio and Gabe Stulman all f…

Advertise the lower prices and then add a flat 'staff service fee'. That way you can advertise the same prices with a similar tip difference.

Re: Year of Upheaval for Restaurants That Ended Tipping

#14

Post by waiseristy »

lil_cain wrote: post #11
Mao_Zedang wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or you know just pay people minimum wage at least. I am not sure why certain service based jobs in America attract a tip and some do not.

That article indicates that there are both tipped, and untipped minimum wages - i.e. tipped staff earn less at minimum wage.

In some states. Washington and a lot of the west coast states require all wages to be paid the same minimum. Not sure why the other states aren't pressured into doing the same.

Re: Year of Upheaval for Restaurants That Ended Tipping

#15

Post by chipperyman573 »

rdl wrote: post #7

I don't see why they can't just keep prices the same and add a "mandatory 20% service charge" at the bottom.

Because then you're just adding a mandatory 20% tip, when a tip is supposed to reward good service. Of course, it really doesn't mean that any more (they're more or less expected/required) but I usually get pretty annoyed when I see a "Mandatory 18% gratuity for parties of 6 or more" thing at the bottom of a menu (even though I usually tip 18-20%). If you're going to require a 20% gratuity, increase all prices by 20% instead of making me multiply every price by 1.2.

At least when tipping is "optional" restaurant owners can pull the "Well you can tip whatever you want, including nothing" card, but if you require 20% then you're just adding a hidden fee.

If you went to walmart and there was a sign at the front of the store saying all prices would be increased by 20%, that wouldn't be acceptable. Why should it for restaurants? If you really want to give 20% of every bill to the wait staff, then increase the prices of everything by 20% and give it to them automatically.

Re: Year of Upheaval for Restaurants That Ended Tipping

#16

Post by Mao_Zedang »

lil_cain wrote: post #11
Mao_Zedang wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or you know just pay people minimum wage at least. I am not sure why certain service based jobs in America attract a tip and some do not.

That article indicates that there are both tipped, and untipped minimum wages - i.e. tipped staff earn less at minimum wage.

I understand this, what I dont understand is why.

Re: Year of Upheaval for Restaurants That Ended Tipping

#17

Post by raverbashing »

smallnamespace wrote: post #10
huhtenberg wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a lot of European countries restaurant tips are completely superficial and not expected, because wait stuff is already properly salaried. This includes all restaurant and cafe sizes.

Yeah, but switching from a tipping to no-tipping equilibrium is probably hard. It's hard for a no-tipping restaurant to compete because the advertised menu prices will simply be higher, and you'd need consumers to mentally adjust all prices ~13% downward. "But some restaurants that adopted a no-tipping policy in 2016 have already revoked it: The New York restaurateurs David Chang, Tom Colicchio and Gabe Stulman all f…

Restaurants need to calculate the equivalent "pre-tipping" price and leave it there for comparison

Re: Year of Upheaval for Restaurants That Ended Tipping

#18

Post by sandGorgon »

mahyarm wrote: post #13
smallnamespace wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, but switching from a tipping to no-tipping equilibrium is probably hard. It's hard for a no-tipping restaurant to compete because the advertised menu prices will simply be higher, and you'd need consumers to mentally adjust all prices ~13% downward. "But some restaurants that adopted a no-tipping policy in 2016 have already revoked it: The New York restaurateurs David Chang, Tom Colicchio and Gabe Stulman all f…

Advertise the lower prices and then add a flat 'staff service fee'. That way you can advertise the same prices with a similar tip difference.

this is exactly that happens in india. it's called "service charge". you dont have to tip extra unless you really want to.

Most restaurants in india clearly mention "we charge X % as service charge"

Re: Year of Upheaval for Restaurants That Ended Tipping

#19

Post by ragebol »

smallnamespace wrote: post #10
huhtenberg wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a lot of European countries restaurant tips are completely superficial and not expected, because wait stuff is already properly salaried. This includes all restaurant and cafe sizes.

Yeah, but switching from a tipping to no-tipping equilibrium is probably hard. It's hard for a no-tipping restaurant to compete because the advertised menu prices will simply be higher, and you'd need consumers to mentally adjust all prices ~13% downward. "But some restaurants that adopted a no-tipping policy in 2016 have already revoked it: The New York restaurateurs David Chang, Tom Colicchio and Gabe Stulman all f…

When I was in the US, I also had to mentally adjust for the incomplete, tax-less, pricing at places.

At the airport, I thought I could buy one last thing from my last few coins and bills of change. Quite a bummer at the register when it turned out it was actually more expensive.

In Europe, sometimes prices even list both the VAT included and excluded prices.

Re: Year of Upheaval for Restaurants That Ended Tipping

#20

Post by [deleted] »

smallnamespace wrote: post #10
huhtenberg wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a lot of European countries restaurant tips are completely superficial and not expected, because wait stuff is already properly salaried. This includes all restaurant and cafe sizes.

Yeah, but switching from a tipping to no-tipping equilibrium is probably hard. It's hard for a no-tipping restaurant to compete because the advertised menu prices will simply be higher, and you'd need consumers to mentally adjust all prices ~13% downward. "But some restaurants that adopted a no-tipping policy in 2016 have already revoked it: The New York restaurateurs David Chang, Tom Colicchio and Gabe Stulman all f…

[deleted]
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