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Ask HN: Should I learn Bootstrap 3 or 4 at this moment?

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Re: Ask HN: Should I learn Bootstrap 3 or 4 at this moment?

#41

Post by gkop »

mightybyte wrote: post #9

It depends on what you want to optimize for. If you're starting a startup and you anticipate having a dedicated design team, I think you're better off making your markup match your domain and hand-rolling the CSS instead of using a framework like Bootstrap. This is the ideal approach IMO because it lets you much more effectively keep the styling out of the markup and in the stylesheets. CSS frameworks by definition r…

> CSS frameworks by definition require you to put styling in your markup.

How do mixin-based CSS frameworks require you to put styling in your markup?

Re: Ask HN: Should I learn Bootstrap 3 or 4 at this moment?

#42

Post by dimino »

ggregoire wrote: post #23

Do people really "learn" Bootstrap? I've been using the version 1, 2 and 3 and I've never felt like I needed to learn it. Usually I just open the doc when I need to use something.

Yeah, people are saying, "No, learn CSS!" but isn't CSS exceedingly simple?

Why can't I just use Bootstrap because I don't feel like designing an app, and Bootstrap is the fastest way to get a consistent layout on web and mobile? What's it got to do with learning at all?

Re: Ask HN: Should I learn Bootstrap 3 or 4 at this moment?

#43

Post by sharmi »

pedalpete wrote: post #2

Learning Bootstrap 3 or 4 should take you very little time, I would suggest you don't learn either of them, but instead take the time to learn CSS (I am of course assuming you are not already a CSS wiz). You can look at the source of Bootstrap to see how they accomplished certain things if you'd like, but if you're doing anything more than prototyping (and even then), I feel there is very little benefit to using Boot…

True this. But

* Learning CSS is not the first priority of a bootstrapped business. The cost associated with a 100kb of css is much lesser compared to creating a layout and all other styles.

* Learning CSS to create a whole layout from scratch can be a daunting task for the uninitiated.

* The best approach would be to start the project with Bootstrap, create a winning product, and iterate to find the best layout you need. Then in a subsequent release, you can redo the same using css. CSS Flex is very easy once you get the hang of it and you do not need any other css layout framework.

Re: Ask HN: Should I learn Bootstrap 3 or 4 at this moment?

#44

Post by dimino »

ams6110 wrote: post #5

It doesn't matter. Because no matter what tech you use in the web app space, it will all be obsolete in a year or two. Your apps will never be done, because the sand will shift underneath them. You'll need to continually update them to keep them working, or abandon them.

Why wash your clothes? Make your bed? Brush your teeth?

You're going to be in the dirt eventually anyway...

Re: Ask HN: Should I learn Bootstrap 3 or 4 at this moment?

#45

Post by dwaltrip »

peller wrote: post #8
pedalpete wrote: post #2

Learning Bootstrap 3 or 4 should take you very little time, I would suggest you don't learn either of them, but instead take the time to learn CSS (I am of course assuming you are not already a CSS wiz). You can look at the source of Bootstrap to see how they accomplished certain things if you'd like, but if you're doing anything more than prototyping (and even then), I feel there is very little benefit to using Boot…

As a backend dev, I wish somebody had told me this exact advice earlier on in my career. CSS does have a fair amount of silly legacy shit, but it's really not all that bad once you dive in. Another good project's source code to learn from is Skeleton. (more simple than bootstrap) CSS version: https://github.com/dhg/Skeleton Sass version: https://github.com/WhatsNewSaes/Skeleton-Sass Edit: For more of a tutorial appro…

A great resource for digging into the nitty gritty fundamentals of layout (the hardest part of CSS, in my mind):

http://book.mixu.net/css/

I came across this when I was looking to gain a more complete mental model of how CSS layout works, as opposed to to the odd assortment of tricks, approaches, and googling I had been relying thus far.

Re: Ask HN: Should I learn Bootstrap 3 or 4 at this moment?

#47

Post by 3131s »

dimino wrote: post #42
ggregoire wrote: post #23

Do people really "learn" Bootstrap? I've been using the version 1, 2 and 3 and I've never felt like I needed to learn it. Usually I just open the doc when I need to use something.

Yeah, people are saying, "No, learn CSS!" but isn't CSS exceedingly simple? Why can't I just use Bootstrap because I don't feel like designing an app, and Bootstrap is the fastest way to get a consistent layout on web and mobile? What's it got to do with learning at all?

> "No, learn CSS!" but isn't CSS exceedingly simple?

No, it's not. I don't want to start a CSS flame war, but at least for layout / positioning I struggle every single time with CSS, especially on sites with dynamic content. CSS is my least favorite part of the web development stack by far.

Re: Ask HN: Should I learn Bootstrap 3 or 4 at this moment?

#48

Post by mightybyte »

gkop wrote: post #41
mightybyte wrote: post #9

It depends on what you want to optimize for. If you're starting a startup and you anticipate having a dedicated design team, I think you're better off making your markup match your domain and hand-rolling the CSS instead of using a framework like Bootstrap. This is the ideal approach IMO because it lets you much more effectively keep the styling out of the markup and in the stylesheets. CSS frameworks by definition r…

> CSS frameworks by definition require you to put styling in your markup. How do mixin-based CSS frameworks require you to put styling in your markup?

Oh, I might not be aware of that type of CSS framework. Can you point me to some examples? I was thinking of frameworks like Bootstrap and Semantic UI.

Re: Ask HN: Should I learn Bootstrap 3 or 4 at this moment?

#49

Post by KayL »

To answer this question, I'm more interested in how do you learn it first.

All these frameworks are just COPY & PASTE the pre-made code. For example, you wanna button in that style: http://v4-alpha.getbootstrap.com/components/buttons/

Copy that code and paste into your HTML. Whatever v3 or v4 are the same way.

If your learning way is memorizing the code without checking the document each time, then I'd say v3.

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