'In particular, there's no physical law that puts a cap on intelligence at the level of human beings.' Maybe not, but there are definitely very physical laws governing everything else, that a superintelligent being's ambitions would run into. A superintelligent being isn't going to be able to build a superliminal reactionless drive if the laws of the universe say it isn't possible. More relevant, a superintelligent b…
The laws of the universe forbid steam locomotives in space, and yet we reached mars regardless. And here we are, barely even regular Inteligences. The laws of computational complexity seem like a stronger candidate for a hard limit, but that only means that to get smarter they will require more matter to distribute comoutations across. The battery limit proposal is just silly.
Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People
571–580 of 607 posts
Re: Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People
#572Earlier quoted context omitted.
Sure, but none of those laws would prevent a superintelligence from generating more than enough electricity to power itself, in principle.
Indeed, this seems like pointing to the speed of light as a limit in a discussion about building faster cars.
Re: Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People
#573For those interested in another very different analysis of the evidence for and against superintelligence being a worthwhile concern, here's Holden Karnofsky, executive director of GiveWell and the related Open Philanthropy Project: - Up until 2016, Holden held the opinion that it was not a worthwhile concern. He describes why he changed his mind here: http://www.openphilanthropy.org/blog/three-key-issues-ive-ch... -…
What does he suggest doing about it? That's always my question for this sort of topic. It seems to me that the only reasonable behavior for someone accepting SAI as a legitimate concern is to advocate defunding all AI researchers, as well as criminal punishments for AI research.
TL;DR: He talks about several avenues of technical and strategy research that seem plausibly very useful and are not currently being pursued by more than a handful of people in the world. Many of these currently-engaged people are precisely the folks the author of this post disparages for being weird or insular.
One of the avenues of technical research he mentions is "transparency, understandability, and robustness against or at least detection of large changes in input distribution" for AI/ML systems. In other words, technical research to produce methods capable of reducing the likelihood of advanced systems behaving in severely bad, unexpected ways.
Re: Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People
#574Earlier quoted context omitted.
An uncaring blind AI wouldn't be very interesting, I would assume whoever had turned it on and was observing it would just turn it off and tweek the algorithm. But I don't think this is even possible as when the AI was in child stage and was learning, it would learn from people, so it would become like people. Or at least understand them. At some point it has to know less than a human and will learn at a rate that hu…
> I don't agree with the assumption that a factory making paperclips will make the transition to a super intelligent AI in a short time frame. Why? Because factories run by humans take a long time to transition? It might take weeks or months to make a process tweak in a human-run factory, but deploying new code happens in seconds or faster.
Re: Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People
#575Earlier quoted context omitted.
Well, this is kind of a red herring, because it's widely known that schools of all types have been drastically increasing their administrative bodies, ballooning costs without actually doing anything for the students with that extra administration. Plus also it's the CATO Institute.
Think about what you're saying: "It's a red herring! We know that schools spend money they get on dumb things!" Yes, that's my point. :) If we could magically fix that, it might--in principle--become a good idea to give them more money. Giving them money does not actually magically fix that. It's worth noting that Maciej forgot that the tech barons he hates actually tried this: https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions…
Re: Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People
#576Earlier quoted context omitted.
Don't the people who control military technology in our current time already have "practically unlimited power over everyone else"?
No, because their power is limited by their role in society and the organization in which they operate. Even the president of the United States has limited powers. If Obama just decided one day that the best course of action was to nuke Moscow and doubled down on doing so it's extremely unlikely he'd be able to do so. There are enough other people with careers, jobs, pension plans and common decency between him and a…
http://blog.nuclearsecrecy.com/2016/11/18/the-president-and-...
You might say "sure, but there are people who have to actually execute those orders." But give the Pentagon some credit--those are people who have been systematically selected because they follow orders quickly and without question. For example, consider what happened to Harold Hering when it became obvious that he was not one of those people.
Re: Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People
#577Orthogonality is defined by Bostrom as the postulate that a super-intelligence can have nearly any arbitrary goals. Here is a short argument as to why ‘orthogonality’ may be false:
In so far as an AGI has a precisely defined goal, it is likely that the AGI cannot be super-intelligent. The reason is because there’s always a certain irreducible amount of fuzziness or ambiguity in the definition of some types of concepts (‘non-trivial’ concepts associated with values don’t have necessary definitions). Let us call these concepts, fuzzy concepts (or f-concepts).
Now imagine that you are trying to define the goals that will let you specify that you want an AGI to doprecisely, but it turns out that for certain goals there’s an unavoidable trade-off: trying to increase the precision of the definitions reduces the cognitive power of the AGI. It’s because non-trivial goals need the aforementioned ‘f-concepts’, and you can’t define these precisely without over simplifying them.
The only way to deal with f-concepts is by using a ‘concept cloud’ – instead of a single crisp definition, you would need to have a ‘cloud’ or ‘cluster’ of multiple slightly different definitions, and it’s the totality of all these that specifies the goals of the AGI.
So for example, such f-concepts (f) would need a whole set of slightly differing definitions (d):
F= (d1, d2, d3, d4, d5, d6…)
But now the AGI needs a way to integrate all the slightly conflicting definitions into a single coherent set. Let us designate the methods that do this as .
But finding better is an instrumental goal (needed for whatever other goals the AGI must have). So unavoidably, extra goals must emerge to handle these f-concepts, in addition to whatever original goals the programmer was trying to specify. And if these ‘extra’ goals conflict too badly with the original ones, then the AGI will be cognitively handicapped.
This falsifies orthogonality: f-concepts can only be handled via the emergence of additional goals to perform the internal conflict-resolution procedures that integrate multiple differing definitions of goals in a ‘concept-cloud’.
In so far as an AGI has goals that can be precisely specified, orthogonality is trivially true, but such an AGI probably can’t become super-intelligent. It’s cognitively handicapped.
In so far as an AGI has fuzzy goals, it can become super-intelligent, but orthogonality is likely falsified, because ‘extra’ goals need to emerge to handle ‘conflict resolution’ and integration of multiple differing definitions in the concept cloud.
All of this just confirms that goal-drift of our future descendants is unavoidable. The irony is that this is the very reason why ‘orthogonality’ may be false.
Re: Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People
#578Here is why AI is reason for concern:
1. The world is made up of patterns. Proof: mathematics.
2. Patterns can be distilled down to data.
3. Machine Learning is highly effective at analysing patterns.
4. Machine Learning construction itself is a pattern, albeit a very complicated one, by human scales.
5. Learning speed is bottlenecked by hardware and data availability. Both of which are being solved at exponential rates.
The other knock is that consciousness and its constituent pieces is a product of evolution, which itself is not outside the realm of physics.(I.e. We're sacks of chemicals) This means it is theoretically possible to reproduce intelligence if the same initial conditions are met.
As silicon poses much shorter time gaps than biological substrates, and as equivalent sensory data are fed into simulated environments, the vectors intercepts are quite clear.
I think the key is whether we believe machine learning will reach a critical threshold where it will be able to interpret higher-level meaning.
There is positive evidence that this has to do with layers of neural circuitry, which recent neural net design has confirmed in output.
Additional layers can be added to machines, but it is not so easy to do with humans.
The danger is in autonomy and might. Autonomy being higher level cognition mentioned earlier, and might being the ability to bruteforce its way through problems by sheer speed and iteration, which computer excel at.
It would be great if you guys can spot flaws in this argument. The conclusions are quite grim at my current outlook. It'll be nice to be proven wrong.
Re: Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People
#579Earlier quoted context omitted.
I don't understand why people have such a weird problem reconciling the brain with the mind. It IS all physical. It's also an unimaginably complex fucking shitload of tiny physical objects working incredibly quickly. If your brain was big enough to see the parts working like little gears of a clock, it would probably be planet sized, or something like that. Huge. I would EVEN say it doesn't raise any interesting phil…
I don't think there's a problem reconciling the brain with the mind, if by 'mind' one means problem-solving ability. The problem is in reconciling the brain with consciousness . There is, as far as I know, no theory that explains how consciousness can arise from matter.
I've come to think that the great consciousness mystery is a psychological one: why are human beings so obsessed with the consciousness mystery? Why do we need so much to believe that we are special?
Should this super AI come to be, I expect it to give the problem of consciousness the same amount of thought we usually give to other people's bowel movements.
Re: Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People
#580Earlier quoted context omitted.
This is exactly the same argument of targeted surveillance vs mass surveillance. Saying "humans have spied on each other for centuries" is nothing but a distraction for how far beyond what should be legal mass surveillance is, because it makes it so easy to have everything on everyone all the time. It's nothing like pass targeted surveillance. If anything it's much more like Stasi-style surveillance, but on a much bi…
That's the opposite of how history has played out with respect to violence, however. It is far easier (and less risky) to kill vast numbers of people now than it was hundreds and thousands of years ago, and yet the risk of any one person being killed by violence is far lower than at any previous point in history.