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Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People

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401–410 of 607 posts

Re: Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People

#401
Observe that in these scenarios the AIs are evil by default, just like a plant on an alien planet would probably be poisonous by default. Without careful tuning, there's no reason that an AI's motivations or values would resemble ours.

For an artificial mind to have anything resembling a human value system, the argument goes, we have to bake those beliefs into the design.

Because we are so nice to the lesser intelligent creatures of our world? We don't even understand our own consciousness, surely our suffering is not very real and we can be used for meat.

Re: Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People

#402
post #262
post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think an income tax that punishes people for making too much money is the right way to go about it. How about instead of punishing people for being rich, discourage the filthy rich from spending money on the frivolous. For instance, set up a luxury tax on expensive cars, private jets and jet fuel, first class transportation and primary residences and hotels that are way above the average value for an area. On…

I think it might be great to encourage the rich to spend as much as possible. Don't the expensive cars, private jets, and first class transportation support whole networks of businesses, and provide employment?

Not that much. For an average rich person, most of their assets are not spend for living/luxury, and they can't realistically be unless said rich are extremely extravagant.

So, unless they are actively invested in some sort of productive scheme, they are just sitting there (e.g. as huge estates, savings etc.).

In any case, it's much better for the economy to have a large middle class, than the equivalent money in fewer rich persons.

Re: Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People

#405
He is completely skipping the most important part. The superintelligence has to have some reason to be in conflict with us. Human beings don't go out of their way to hunt down and eliminate ants. They don't find out what ants eat and sieze control of it to manipulate them. There is no reason to think that a superintelligent machine would be likely to present terrible interference to us proposed.

So it's super smart and has its own goals. We can reliably presume that it will need energy to achieve those goals. Will it need to achieve them quickly? Why? Would the superintelligence be shortsighted enough to provoke humans into active combat against it? I see no reason to just assume we know the thing would have human eradication as a goal, need exorbitant amounts of energy and resources because it sees achieving its goals as a terribly time-critical thing to do, etc.

Also, if we're going to build a brain and assume no quantum weirdness - why assume the total absence of a subjective morality? Why assume completely immunity to social influence, which the brains we observe most all encounter?

And let's not forget - human beings are in a weird spot, intelligence-wise. We're smart enough to achieve things, but we're not smart enough to be crippled by the profound lack of control we have over things. We're totally comfortable going out and driving around all day, even though we claim to value human life extremely highly and even though we know that causing deaths of innocent human beings is not THAT far-fetched of an outcome of driving a car. I would be unsurprised if we flipped on a super-AI and after 5 minutes it simply stopped in its tracks, having determined that the probability that some action it would take would result in its own destruction with a non-zero probability and that it is instead taking the safe route and not acting at all. No matter how superintelligent it is, it is not going to be able to magically compensate for the influences of chaos theory which destroy the ability to be certain about ANY prediction. We, as humans, feel very clever with our assumed spherical cows, frictionless surfaces, homogenous air pressure and zero wind resistance. Why would a superintelligence also be comfortable with that?

Re: Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People

#406
post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Calfornia is mismanged to hell. The bay area has some of the worst roads in the nation with very mild weather and a wealthy tax base. It cost $8billion to make 1 or 2 miles of central subway and only €11 billion to make the worlds longest tunnel under the alps. I have the same income tax rate as I did in canada yet there isnt universal healthcare and far more economic inequality. It goes on and on. If you trippled th…

You lost me on your rant about taxation without universal healthcare when the vast apportionment of that tax (and mis-spending like on the Iraq Occupation) is Federal not CA. The problem is one of regulatory capture - corporate vested interests control the governance process and that means peons are getting less and less each day for their tax revenues.

> The problem is one of regulatory capture - corporate vested interests control the governance process

The problems with many things, but especially the price of SF Muni's new Central Subway and the like, are more about union interests controlling the governance process than corporate. Remember that they do prevailing-wage construction (which somehow means they pay the highest wage out there, not the average/median) to their construction workers.

The millions/billions spent on environmental-review studies and lawsuits are another matter as well.

Re: Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People

#407
post #262
post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think an income tax that punishes people for making too much money is the right way to go about it. How about instead of punishing people for being rich, discourage the filthy rich from spending money on the frivolous. For instance, set up a luxury tax on expensive cars, private jets and jet fuel, first class transportation and primary residences and hotels that are way above the average value for an area. On…

I think it might be great to encourage the rich to spend as much as possible. Don't the expensive cars, private jets, and first class transportation support whole networks of businesses, and provide employment?

Yes, but you also need to look at the products of those people's labor and other things that labor could be used for. Do we need more people building and crewing luxury yachts, or building and operating hospitals and sheltered accommodation? In both cases people are paid to do work, but the products of that work are very different.

But in practice much of the wealth of super-wealthy people is actually either tide up in the value of the businesses that they own, which are often doing economically valuable things, or is invested in useful enterprises (shares), or funds useful activities (bonds). It's not as though the net wealth of Warren Buffet is all being thrown on hookers and blow.

There are already ways to direct the spending of the wealthy towards more productive uses, such as consumption taxes on luxury goods. But if they take their wealth to other countries with laxer consumption taxes, there's no a lot we can do about it. So we're back to the libertarian argument. At some point you get into questions of freedom and individual rights.

Re: Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People

#409

"I live in California, which has the highest poverty rate in the United States, even though it's home to Silicon Valley. I see my rich industry doing nothing to improve the lives of everyday people and indigent people around us." This is trivially false. Over a hundred billionaires have now pledged to donate the majority of their wealth, and the list includes many tech people like Bill Gates, Larry Ellison, Mark Zuck…

I say they should keep their money and control! Educate and involve them in important things early. The HARC initiative looks great. Such an initiative could answer questions like: What are important problems? What do we need to do to efficiently solve such problems? Have we spent too much effort on a single solutions? Is it time to try another way? What can we do to bypass bureaucracy? I trust businesses to have a mindset for risk and results. In my opinion charities behave more like guardians preserving/nurturing more than making a 10X change.

Re: Superintelligence: The Idea That Eats Smart People

#410

I've always wondered if the problems an intelligence solves are exponentially hard so even if we build a super intelligence it wouldn't be all that much smarter than we are. For example compare how many more cities in the traveling salesman problem a super computer can solve vs your grandmas pc. It's more but surprisingly not all that many more. What do you think of that idea?

It doesn't even hold with humans. Take a look at John von Neumann and his brain was pushed down the human birth canal.

We really have a poor idea of what super intelligence is - none of us can even understand people much more intelligent than ourselves.

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