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How Apple Alienated Mac Loyalists

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Re: How Apple Alienated Mac Loyalists

#281

Post by dkonofalski »

cookiecaper wrote: post #86
electic wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did take a close look at the Surface Pro. Sorry, the build quality is nowhere near a MacBook Pro. Secondly, I found the touch screen very gimmicky. I tried using it for a week and found that my hand just hurt lifting it up repeatedly and also hated switching context from the keyboard to the screen. Not to mention, the screen was full of smudge marks after awhile. To be honest, I really found myself using the keyboa…

The Surface's touch screen is not meant for full-time use. It's a hybrid device. If you need a pure tablet, get a pure tablet. I really like my ThinkPad Yoga's hybrid featureset. I hate to say it, but this post definitely has the ring of fanboyism. The build quality of the Surface is "nowhere near a MacBook Pro" ... without specifying anything that's actually worse. The point of the MBP is "always to be leap years ah…

While I agree with you on a few points, I think it gets drowned out by the ring of anti-fanboyism too.

The build quality on MacBooks is well-known in the industry and, if you go to a Microsoft Store (or own one), it's readily visible that the build quality isn't on par. Don't get me wrong, it's really good, but it's not MacBook good. This isn't the greatest example because I don't own one, but look at this shot (https://si.wsj.net/public/resources/images/BN-QM003_MSFTst_P...) and compare even the fit and finish of the cutouts.

As for the specs, I don't know where you got that the point of the MBP is to be leap years ahead on specs and I'm pretty sure this is a straw man that you set up just to argue against it. Apple has never been about pushing specs but only the overall experience of using their machines. In fact, in a lot of benchmarks, Apple devices outperform similarly (or even better) spec'd PCs simply because of Apple's ecosystem advantage.

You're right that they're not the end-all be-all, but you should probably make sure you're being objective yourself before suggesting that someone else has had too much kool-aid.

Re: How Apple Alienated Mac Loyalists

#282

Post by beat »

jamespo wrote: post #172
_ph_ wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, if he wants to be a replacement, one has to assume he wants to be compatible and keep using the applications he currently uses. Any non-Mac system might be an "alternative" but not a "replacement".

$2k buys a lot of applications

It's not just applications, it's time.

I'm in the middle of producing a 17 song concept album. If I switch platforms, I have to completely redo all my mixes and learn a whole lot of new tooling. What's the cost of that? Dozens of hours of my time...

Re: How Apple Alienated Mac Loyalists

#284

Post by tech2 »

avn2109 wrote: post #225
untog wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Secondly, I found the touch screen very gimmicky. I tried using it for a week and found that my hand just hurt lifting it up repeatedly and also hated switching context from the keyboard to the screen. I agree, but on the other hand, I'm yet to find something that requires the use of the touchscreen. So I don't use it. Unless I'm carrying it around like a tablet, in which case it's a great feature to have.

Yeah but you paid the money, reliability, and weight penalties for a touchscreen for no reason.

I bought the Dell XPS 13 with the hidpi display. I didn't buy it for the touchscreen and I couldn't buy it without if I wanted the resolution.

I'd have happily paid less for the same resolution but longer battery life (low power for driving the touch sensor and more for driving the display to a greater brightness to support the same display brightness).

I figure I should have put up with a lower resolution display tbh, which is sad.

Re: How Apple Alienated Mac Loyalists

#285

Post by kilroy123 »

autoreleasepool wrote: post #106

After being an Apple "Loyalist" for over 15 years, I recently sold my rMBP and built a desktop (i7 4790k, GTX 1080, 16Gb DDR3 @ 2933Mhz). It was by far the best hardware decision I have ever made. Building the system was an absolute blast. Plus, I now have an extremely powerful PC with first class Linux support, tons of I/O ports, and no vendor lock in. The best part is it cost me about 1/3 of the price of a (maxed-o…

I too would love to have a beefy desktop build and dual monitors. I miss the days of shopping around for parts and doing it yourself.

Sadly, I live abroad and move a lot, so not an option.

Re: How Apple Alienated Mac Loyalists

#286

Post by tokipin »

brightball wrote: post #59
beat wrote: post #16

My main computer is a five year old 17" MBP. I've upgraded it to the max and done repairs to maintain it. I need the computational power - I use it for programming, photo editing at scale, and recording/mixing music. It would cost me $3000 to replace it with a computer that is not significantly more powerful, has a smaller screen and less I/O functionality, and would be incompatible with my audio interface unless I d…

In the same boat with a maxed out 2010 17" MBP. RAM is maxed and I've upgraded the HD 3 times. The lack of a new 17" is blocking my upgrade entirely and has me shopping for Linux laptops at the point that it finally dies. I use my laptop as a second screen when I work and a screen smaller than 17 makes it less functional in terms of readability from a distance.

For what it's worth, when I switched from Windows I was looking for a 17" macbook because I have a vision issue. I ended up buying a used 15" retina MBP and it's actually easier on my eyes than my 17" Windows laptop was. The retina makes a huge difference and the weight/form factor is very convenient.

Re: How Apple Alienated Mac Loyalists

#287

Post by snoman »

dkonofalski wrote: post #265
snoman wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're starting to sound like one of those funny infomercials where everything is black and white and the actor fumbles with some overtly awkward action, that is otherwise mundane... Holding their outstretched arm up over their head with their other arm, a grimace of strain on their face, trying to scroll with their pinky finger. All the while the voice-over is asking why you'd subject yourself to this. It's a, very…

I think the point, though, is that your hand wouldn't naturally rest on the table near the screen like that. The main reason you're comfortable doing that is because you know you can scroll with your hand in that position. The natural resting position would be to relax your hands off the keyboard after typing and that puts it squarely in the area of the (comically) huge trackpad.

The hundreds of millions of people that have used a mouse can attest to how 'natural' it is.

Re: How Apple Alienated Mac Loyalists

#288

Post by rubyn00bie »

ndesaulniers wrote: post #280
rubyn00bie wrote: post #125

The big problem with Apples professional lineup is it's lack of GPU upgrades and power. Along with supporting the GPU manufactures by adopting standards and improving them. I'm tired of them and others blaming intel. x86 is no longer where huge increases in computing power will really come from-- we all clearly see this due to the laws of physics. Parallelizing computation for all its problems, is the future, and GPU…

> What Apple needs to do is make the mac lineup based modular components. E.g. "Here is a box you can slide a video card into Like Razer has?

Yes but for all the components: ram, CPU, ssd/m2... hell being able to slide a new box in that contains a new mobo would be amazing.

Re: How Apple Alienated Mac Loyalists

#289

Post by cookiecaper »

dkonofalski wrote: post #281
cookiecaper wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Surface's touch screen is not meant for full-time use. It's a hybrid device. If you need a pure tablet, get a pure tablet. I really like my ThinkPad Yoga's hybrid featureset. I hate to say it, but this post definitely has the ring of fanboyism. The build quality of the Surface is "nowhere near a MacBook Pro" ... without specifying anything that's actually worse. The point of the MBP is "always to be leap years ah…

While I agree with you on a few points, I think it gets drowned out by the ring of anti-fanboyism too. The build quality on MacBooks is well-known in the industry and, if you go to a Microsoft Store (or own one), it's readily visible that the build quality isn't on par. Don't get me wrong, it's really good, but it's not MacBook good. This isn't the greatest example because I don't own one, but look at this shot ( htt…

>As for the specs, I don't know where you got that the point of the MBP is to be leap years ahead on specs and I'm pretty sure this is a straw man that you set up just to argue against it.

The post I replied to says:

"- Bump the specs. The whole point of the Pro is it is leap years ahead of everyone on processor, HD, and RAM."

Re: How Apple Alienated Mac Loyalists

#290

Post by mrpippy »

ewzimm wrote: post #250
mrpippy wrote: post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Source? Or did you just compare clock rates? Intel has improved single-thread performance by much more than 1% from Sandy Bridge to Skylake

Going by benchmark aggregates from PassMark. 2860QM: http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Core+i7-2860QM... 6700HQ: http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Core+i7-6700HQ... 6920HQ: http://www.cpubenchmark.net/cpu.php?cpu=Intel+Core+i7-6920HQ...

Interesting. For comparison, Geekbench 4 single/multi-core results (from https://browser.primatelabs.com/mac-benchmarks):

MacBook Pro (17-inch Late 2011, i7-2860QM): 3180 / 9593

MacBook Pro (15-inch Late 2016, i7-6700HQ): 3968 (+24%) / 12189 (+27%)

MacBook Pro (15-inch Late 2016, i7-6820HQ): 4093 (+29%) / 12883 (+26%)

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