Thrilled that the idea that ones basic needs be met as a basic human right is gaining traction. Granted, in the form of our most common commodity-abstraction apparatus (cash).
Finland will hand out cash to 2000 jobless people to test universal basic income
191–200 of 413 posts
Re: Finland will hand out cash to 2000 jobless people to test universal basic income
#192Earlier quoted context omitted.
Why don't we do a basic income lottery? - Anyone except previous winners can enter. - You can only enter once per drawing. - As the pool increases the payout does not, only the number of winners. - Winners get a basic income for life. - As another condition they agree to an amount of monitoring so that we can effectively study how they behave with the basic income. - This one would be hard, but you might have to be m…
I bet winning in a lottery feels a lot different to receiving your regular allowance the same as everyone else. I think this would affect behaviour.
Yes, a lottery winner would be swamped by many surrounding them. Less likely to happen in a trial where the full community is receiving a similar income.
Re: Finland will hand out cash to 2000 jobless people to test universal basic income
#193I feel like we're creating a new government program to counter the failures of an existing one: education. If people had marketable skills, it would be a lot easier to find work. Perhaps tax revenue should go to education and training, instead.
I think we're a long way off from total automation of most industries.
Re: Finland will hand out cash to 2000 jobless people to test universal basic income
#194Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's still a disincentive: my effectively hourly rate decreases the more hours I work. Not sure how that's fair. A flat tax is the only fair tax. You make more, you pay more, but you aren't taking an effective pay cut per hour based on simply working more.
Progressive taxation is more fair from the standpoint of society at large. You're being myopic in only considering it from your point of view. How is it "fair" to force someone who is barely making ends meet and struggles to sometimes put food on the table to pay the same exact tax rate as someone who is rich, and whose biggest economic struggle is wondering whether to upgrade to a bigger yacht this year or next year…
The poor person isn't paying Yacht tax, country club tax, box seats tax, Porsche tax.
Re: Finland will hand out cash to 2000 jobless people to test universal basic income
#195I hate being "that guy" but am I the only one who expects this particular brand of communism to not be any better than previous attempts? Somebody's going to have to pay for this...
"Somebody" has to pay for welfare, too. The fact that all social welfare programs have a cost is not a reason to reject all social welfare out of hand. Do you really think welfare programs should be abolished? What level of starving to death and freezing to death in the streets are you comfortable with?
Re: Finland will hand out cash to 2000 jobless people to test universal basic income
#196Instead of just giving people money our governments at federal / state / local levels should become employers of last resort for everyone who has exhausted their welfare or unemployment benefits. Guarantee 30 hours / week at minimum wage to anyone who wants to work. Even if it's just trail maintenance or graffiti cleanup they will at least be maintaining basic employment skills, and have enough spare time to retrain…
How about actual job and skills training, instead? I would much rather my tax dollars go to training an electrician than some made-up bureaucratic job.
Re: Finland will hand out cash to 2000 jobless people to test universal basic income
#197Earlier quoted context omitted.
The problem with your thinking is that it ignores that it takes "work" to get people those basic necessities you refer to. So there absolutely is a danger in disincentivizing people to work, if people contribute nothing, but consume even these basic needs. I'm not against basic income, but there absolutely is risk to society.
Worth noting that less than 100 people on Earth have the net worth of half of Earth's population; half of the world's population is 3.5 billion people. Notable source: https://theguardian.com/business/2016/jan/18/richest-62-bill...
Do less than 100 people on Earth have taxable monthly income (which can be used for UBI) same as half of world's population? Or same income as UBI for half of world's population?
Net worth is irrelevant.
Re: Finland will hand out cash to 2000 jobless people to test universal basic income
#198As many have noted, this is not UBI; full stop. Also, you can't "test" something that is supposed to be universal by definition, on a micro scale and to a selected subset.
Re: Finland will hand out cash to 2000 jobless people to test universal basic income
#199Instead of just giving people money our governments at federal / state / local levels should become employers of last resort for everyone who has exhausted their welfare or unemployment benefits. Guarantee 30 hours / week at minimum wage to anyone who wants to work. Even if it's just trail maintenance or graffiti cleanup they will at least be maintaining basic employment skills, and have enough spare time to retrain…
How about actual job and skills training, instead? I would much rather my tax dollars go to training an electrician than some made-up bureaucratic job.
It's not either / or. Someone can work 30 hours / week and still have time for training. I do agree that we should do more to get the long-term unemployed into training programs at community colleges and trade schools.