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Tech workers pledge to never build a database of Muslims

latimes.com

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Re: Tech workers pledge to never build a database of Muslims

#281

Post by tptacek »

ryandrake wrote: post #279
tptacek wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a joke about HN, right? Hey. I'm getting some mileage out of this on Twitter and you're getting a little jumped on, but: if you're not joking, this is good news. It's kind of great news. It means all you have to do is learn a bit about the labor movement to see a whole new dimension of possibilities for intervening against a system we're widely concerned about.

Fair enough, labor unions. Brain no longer working, thanks for leading me by the nose to it. So we need to get software engineers, who as a group tend to be openly hostile to the idea of unions, to embrace collective bargaining.

Not all unions are about salary and shop rules. Look at the history of Polish Solidarity!

Re: Tech workers pledge to never build a database of Muslims

#282

Post by hprotagonist »

Fomite wrote: post #93
milge wrote: post #3

Sadly, there will always be tech workers willing to do this for the right price. As I get older, I'm starting to wonder if not following my "tech morals" would've brought more success.

Pretty sure Palantir is already thinking about their bid.

when your biggest shareholder is on the transition team of the most nepotistic administration since warren harding, you betcha.

Re: Tech workers pledge to never build a database of Muslims

#283

Post by protomyth »

tptacek wrote: post #271
protomyth wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you trying to affect change or just have out of work techs? I can point to a long history of groups entering politics affecting change, can you do the same with a pledge to quit?

Both!

I guess jokes on me, I should have known from the curtness of your first reply and when you wouldn't answer my question that you were just trolling me.

Re: Tech workers pledge to never build a database of Muslims

#284

Post by tptacek »

protomyth wrote: post #283
tptacek wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Both!

I guess jokes on me, I should have known from the curtness of your first reply and when you wouldn't answer my question that you were just trolling me.

I'm confused. That was a sincere response.

Re: Tech workers pledge to never build a database of Muslims

#286

Post by AlexandrB »

throwanem wrote: post #203
_Codemonkeyism wrote: post #158

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Although I'm a fan of 'Google it yourself' here is the first result from Google https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Participation_of_medical_profe... I'm sure with a little effort you can find better ones should you be interested in that topic.

I've never been quite sure that the ethical question here is as firmly settled as the organizations cited first in that article consider it to be. Is it ethical to refuse to participate in lethal injection, knowing that the result will be an execution instead performed by electric chair, or gas chamber, or hanging, or firing squad? Each of these methods is employed as an alternative to lethal injection by at least on…

Lethal injection is not humane[1]. There's evidence that the person being executed suffers tremendously but can't express it due to the use of paralytics as part of the "cocktail".

I'd rather get the guillotine.

[1] http://www.amnestyusa.org/our-work/issues/death-penalty/leth...

Re: Tech workers pledge to never build a database of Muslims

#287

Post by kevinr »

tptacek wrote: post #281
ryandrake wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Fair enough, labor unions. Brain no longer working, thanks for leading me by the nose to it. So we need to get software engineers, who as a group tend to be openly hostile to the idea of unions, to embrace collective bargaining.

Not all unions are about salary and shop rules. Look at the history of Polish Solidarity!

And not all organization is union organization. 5-10% of employees speaking up can have an effect.

Re: Tech workers pledge to never build a database of Muslims

#288

Post by idlewords »

ryandrake wrote: post #279
tptacek wrote: post #275

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is a joke about HN, right? Hey. I'm getting some mileage out of this on Twitter and you're getting a little jumped on, but: if you're not joking, this is good news. It's kind of great news. It means all you have to do is learn a bit about the labor movement to see a whole new dimension of possibilities for intervening against a system we're widely concerned about.

Fair enough, labor unions. Brain no longer working, thanks for leading me by the nose to it. So we need to get software engineers, who as a group tend to be openly hostile to the idea of unions, to embrace collective bargaining.

I don't think software engineers were so much hostile as indifferent. And now we're wandering into an area where people want to take a stand against their own management, but are worried about doing it alone for fear of retribution.

This is exactly what labor law is designed to help do, and I can assure you people are interested.

Re: Tech workers pledge to never build a database of Muslims

#289

Post by kevinr »

ryandrake wrote: post #274
tptacek wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many people do you think would need to sign this for it to have a material impact on recruiting and retention for big companies? Let's not be fuzzy about it. Let's see what the goal needs to be, and then talk about how reachable it is.

That would require a high degree of speculation, since I can't think of any example in history in any industry where "employees not willing to work for a company" managed to have a material impact on that company. I think this is uncharted territory.

Has anybody managed to move your company up the Joel Test[0] by threatening to leave, or management learning they missed a hire? Serious question.

[0]: https://www.joelonsoftware.com/2000/08/09/the-joel-test-12-s...

Re: Tech workers pledge to never build a database of Muslims

#290

Post by kevinr »

wjossey wrote: post #2

It's a lovely gesture, and an important sign of solidarity; however, it'a merely that, just a gesture. I hope that SV and the tech industry leverages its wealth and technical legal capabilities to fight these sorts of actions in court, unlike their responses to privacy intrusions by the federal government, British intelligence, and other foreign groups.

Respectfully, I'm interviewing for jobs right now. I did NOT just sign that pledge as a gesture.
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