Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yahoo lost $650 million last quarter, why do you think anyone would take the deal in the first place?
IP. Yahoo!'s patents are valued between $4B and $8B, depending on who you ask.
What if you ask Verizon?
Verizon Explores Lower Price or Even Exit from Yahoo Deal
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Re: Verizon Explores Lower Price or Even Exit from Yahoo Deal
#62Earlier quoted context omitted.
And that's a fair, justified opinion to have. But attacking someone who holds a contrary opinion for having ulterior motives is an extremely uncharitable thing to do.
It wasn't an attack and my summation was correct as he has friends that work there.
It's crazy i am seeing this on HN. I feel Yahoo is all worth for the following reasons:
1) 2 decades old brand name everyone aware of
2) Yahoo! has some good products which is used by tons of people like Flickr, Finance, search(12% market share [0]), weather, media.
They just don't have a mammoth money making one product which subsidizes the rest of the business like Google. Not to mention the tech talent and the culture that Yahoo! brings to Verizon.
If you have any solid argument about why $4 billion is a waste, i would definitely like to hear.
0 : https://www.comscore.com/Insights/Rankings/comScore-Releases...
Re: Verizon Explores Lower Price or Even Exit from Yahoo Deal
#63Let's also not downplay the "Yahoo" brand name. It does not have much high impact negative publicity associated to it (yet). The name "Yahoo!" goes as far back as the Internet for modern day users i.e. 30+ yrs age group. If Verizon can put a nice spin to it and through micro-filtration of the brand whatever filtrate is left, as long as it is somewhat appealing it would sell, let it be a search engine or whatever new product Verizon offers free-of-cost to its subscribers over its data network. Verizon owns AOL and with that a few mobile advertising companies. As TV content is gradually getting further away form traditional set-top-box nightmarish cable providers and more towards individual content companies (Netflix, Amazon Video, HULU, HBO etc), this would be a good step for Verizon to head in that direction as well, maybe not produce original content (such as Netflix/Amazon) but perhaps air exclusive sports events. At the end of the day, it is all about maintaining your monopoly.
Re: Verizon Explores Lower Price or Even Exit from Yahoo Deal
#64Yahoo controls 8% of search traffic and costs $4bn. Google controls 64% of search traffic and costs $558bn. That's a 17-fold difference in the price for 1% of the traffic. Even more if you take US search traffic only (to exclude Yahoo Japan). Verizon can get rid of the costly parts of Yahoo (mostly its media business) and have its own small Google to make cash. That was $1.8bn per year in 2015, while Yahoo's overall…
I don't know man. but if you loan me $4bn I will buy Yahoo and run it myself. I too don't understand how they can't make Yahoo a success. They have a couple of great products that people use like Fantasy sports and Finance. And mail would be just fine if they'd remove all the crap so it would run faster. Lots of non techy still uses yahoo mail, and that won't change as long as the service exists.
User metrics may not look so great. I have no idea what Yahoo's are but over the next few years most of those mail users are going to be accessing through the phone or checking their webmail a handful of times a year until they forget they have it. They could keep habitual users for decades but that won't be worth billions of dollars.
I used the phrase "management assisted suicide" recently, which basically means figuring out how to maximize return to shareholders given a future that guarantees death.
Re: Verizon Explores Lower Price or Even Exit from Yahoo Deal
#65Yahoo controls 8% of search traffic and costs $4bn. Google controls 64% of search traffic and costs $558bn. That's a 17-fold difference in the price for 1% of the traffic. Even more if you take US search traffic only (to exclude Yahoo Japan). Verizon can get rid of the costly parts of Yahoo (mostly its media business) and have its own small Google to make cash. That was $1.8bn per year in 2015, while Yahoo's overall…
That's like saying Apple is worth $600 billion, Motorola is worth "only $12 billion", but has 1/10 of Apple's market share, so therefore it must be a great deal to buy Motorola. Wait, actually that's exactly what Google thought - and they quickly saw the error in that sort of thinking after they purchased it. Do you see how that argument is flawed? Leaders in a market tend to be worth much more and have much higher p…
I thought they sold Motorola because all the other OEM's were threatening mutiny, specifically Samsung was creating their own OS bec they were worried about being priced out of the market.
Re: Verizon Explores Lower Price or Even Exit from Yahoo Deal
#66One benefit of these incidents at Yahoo! is that they represent salient, clear examples of the cost of poor information security. CIOs and security directors will be able to point to this deal as evidence that poor security can have material impact on the business and destroy massive shareholder value, even years after the fact. A 6.5% intra-day dip sends a clear message. Even a CFO can now see that information secur…
Currently, Yahoo's only raison d'etre is to serve as a warning to others.
Re: Verizon Explores Lower Price or Even Exit from Yahoo Deal
#67Verizon would be stupid not to walk away from the deal at this point. Setting aside that $4 billion was clearly way too much, Verizon, as the parent company, would be liable for any lawsuits against Yahoo resulting from the last few leaks.
It's funny that $4b is deemed "way too much" for Yahoo when Snapchat is valued at $20b something, and Linkedin was bought for $26b. And Instagram and Whatsapp and all the other unicorns.
It seems you are just randomly comparing tech companies by bid/sale value...what about actual value? There is incredible value to LinkedIn, and the 7x multiple is entirely sensible. They have the world's largest resume database, active users, major network effects, and near zero competition.
Yahoo has nothing close to that. I'm not saying that drives a 4B$ valuation exactly, but comparing Yahoo to LinkedIn is apples to oranges.
Re: Verizon Explores Lower Price or Even Exit from Yahoo Deal
#68OK, what's it going to take to keep tumblr running? That's literally all I care about here. Everything else in Yahoo can be gotten or done elsewhere, but tumblr's a social network, so there's value in preserving those connections.
The short answer is: a ton of money.
Tumblr has insanely high operating costs and practically no revenue stream. Yahoo has spent a lot of time and money (while fighting with Tumblr people) to get these costs down, but much of that work would be undone to separate Tumblr from Yahoo.
So much of Tumblr's traffic is comprised "non-monetizable" porn sites that Yahoo foots the CDN bill for, which does nothing to build the brand or the social aspect of the service. They can't truly crack down on it though, because that would reveal the truth: there isn't that much real use to justify the spending.
Re: Verizon Explores Lower Price or Even Exit from Yahoo Deal
#69Earlier quoted context omitted.
It wasn't an attack and my summation was correct as he has friends that work there.
It's crazy i am seeing this on HN. I feel Yahoo is all worth for the following reasons: 1) 2 decades old brand name everyone aware of 2) Yahoo! has some good products which is used by tons of people like Flickr, Finance, search(12% market share [0]), weather, media. They just don't have a mammoth money making one product which subsidizes the rest of the business like Google. Not to mention the tech talent and the cul…
Market share is irrelevant if you have to run at a loss to obtain it. I can steal all of Netflix and Hulu's market share if you give me a few billion quarterly and don't require that I'm ever profitable, care to invest in me? I'll have an excellent brand as well, everyone loves free TV.
The price is pretty low now, if you are confidant in your assement why not buy?
Re: Verizon Explores Lower Price or Even Exit from Yahoo Deal
#70Can anyone explain to me why Yahoo is not worth over $4B?
Sure thing! Imagine if I had two friends, Google and Yahoo. Both are asking me if they can borrow a dollar. Over the last few years when Google borrows a dollar it gives back an extra 3.5 cents the next year as a thank you. On the opposite side, when Yahoo has borrowed a dollar they've lost 13 cents within the next year. Left to their own devices, Yahoo will implode and be out of money in under 7 years, likely much s…
Halve staff?