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The bank lent me $2m so I spent it on strippers and cars

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Re: The bank lent me $2m so I spent it on strippers and cars

#121

Post by nulagrithom »

dgreensp wrote: post #59

> I was just unlucky I guess that it happened to me. People like this who have no sense of personal responsibility are an evil in the world. He spends millions of dollars of other people's money, declares bankruptcy (presumably), and when his actions are deemed dishonest and immoral, though not technically illegal, he acts like that's just name-calling and gets right back up on his high horse. Remind you of any Presi…

> Remind you of any Presidents-elect?

Is that really necessary? I'm getting a little sick of Trump replacing Hitler in Godwin's law. We had a detox week for a reason. (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=13108404)

Re: The bank lent me $2m so I spent it on strippers and cars

#122

Post by jjeaff »

Bartweiss wrote: post #96
verbify wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He didn't find the windfall - they just gave him a large line of credit. You could claim it was fraudulent because he didn't plan on paying them back, but it's not the same as suddenly finding money in your account.

Yep, significant difference. I've seen several stories of people prosecuted for spending improper deposits, but presumably a loan - where risk is implied and defaulting is an understood practice - is a different beast.

He seems to be trying to justify his actions by calling it a loan, but I've never heard of a loan where the bank tells you that you can just start over drafting your account and let it go negative, then pay us back later.

Re: The bank lent me $2m so I spent it on strippers and cars

#123

Post by raesene6 »

apapli wrote: post #30
sflcnetwork wrote: post #17

It's unbelievable how the bank didn't notice for that long. That goes to show the power of what a sysadmin at a bank can have, take money and cover his/her tracks. Unfortunately for this guy he was in no such position.

They definitely would have noticed, but anyone who cared at the bank was a beneficiary - more loans equals higher commissions. I think the problem here is that the bank employees saw no reason to intervene, even though they should have, as clearly the guy needed help (responsible lending practices here in Oz ignored). I expect that is why his conviction was quashed.

I didn't see any indication in the article that the bank knew, and as there is no way this loan would pass their audit checks, I really doubt anyone got commission for it.

My guess would be a mistake in a system and a line of credit got attached to the wrong account. Should they have better checks in place, sure, but there's nothing in the article to suggest they knowingly lent him the cash.

Re: The bank lent me $2m so I spent it on strippers and cars

#124

Post by notheguyouthink »

scotty79 wrote: post #104
pktgen wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> He did nothing to defraud the bank or mislead it. He simply had access to a large line of credit, and used it. If the bank wants it's money back, that's a civil matter, not a criminal one. It's their responsibility to ask for it back. He was drawing on this line of credit, which he knew he was legally obligated to pay back, without ever intending to pay it back. That sure seems like fraud to me. There is a differen…

> without ever intending to pay it back How can you know that? He himself writes that he was waiting for the bank to ask for some money back and intended to deal with it when it comes. Lack of detailed planning for something isn't the same as lack of intention to do something when it happens. Lots of people take loans without precisely knowing where they'll find money to pay them back.

> Lots of people take loans without precisely knowing where they'll find money to pay them back.

Hell, i'd say in almost all cases that is true. How am i going to know if i'll be at my current job long enough to pay back that car loan? Hypothetically i will have a job, and will pay it back, but in reality i have no idea how i'll pay it back.

At best, i can accurately predict X months of payments. After that, it's all just educated guesses.

Re: The bank lent me $2m so I spent it on strippers and cars

#125

Post by imgabe »

adekok wrote: post #51

The article doesn't way why he was found not guilty, but I'll make my guess. He did nothing to defraud the bank or mislead it. He simply had access to a large line of credit, and used it. If the bank wants it's money back, that's a civil matter, not a criminal one. It's their responsibility to ask for it back. This reeks of incompetence on the part of the bank, followed by outright malice. They put an innocent guy in…

It does say he "mistakenly" had this line of credit. At least in the US if $2 million "mistakenly" shows up in your bank account, and you know it's not yours and you spend it anyway, that's a crime.

Now, that's not the same as having a line of credit mistakenly opened, but there's some logic to it being a crime.

Re: The bank lent me $2m so I spent it on strippers and cars

#126

Post by mikeash »

restalis wrote: post #120
mikeash wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure what your point is. I mean, you're right, but why would I view the standard that way?

"why would I view the standard that way?" That is closer to the core human nature for a lot of people. Many people want to live and enjoy life (more than enjoying the good perks of being honest). Playing by the rules is just a mean to an end not a purpose in itself.

So what? It's human nature to bash in the head of a stranger so you can take their food, but I wouldn't accept someone calling it "unlucky" that they happened across a defenseless stranger all alone with some good food.

Re: The bank lent me $2m so I spent it on strippers and cars

#127

Post by raesene6 »

scotty79 wrote: post #104
pktgen wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> He did nothing to defraud the bank or mislead it. He simply had access to a large line of credit, and used it. If the bank wants it's money back, that's a civil matter, not a criminal one. It's their responsibility to ask for it back. He was drawing on this line of credit, which he knew he was legally obligated to pay back, without ever intending to pay it back. That sure seems like fraud to me. There is a differen…

> without ever intending to pay it back How can you know that? He himself writes that he was waiting for the bank to ask for some money back and intended to deal with it when it comes. Lack of detailed planning for something isn't the same as lack of intention to do something when it happens. Lots of people take loans without precisely knowing where they'll find money to pay them back.

That's easy, he had no money to pay it back, ergo it's fair to conclude he had no intention of paying it back.

It's one thing to go a couple of thousand overdrawn, quite another to spend $2 million when you have no source of income.

Re: The bank lent me $2m so I spent it on strippers and cars

#128

Post by DevX101 »

imgabe wrote: post #125
adekok wrote: post #51

The article doesn't way why he was found not guilty, but I'll make my guess. He did nothing to defraud the bank or mislead it. He simply had access to a large line of credit, and used it. If the bank wants it's money back, that's a civil matter, not a criminal one. It's their responsibility to ask for it back. This reeks of incompetence on the part of the bank, followed by outright malice. They put an innocent guy in…

It does say he "mistakenly" had this line of credit. At least in the US if $2 million "mistakenly" shows up in your bank account, and you know it's not yours and you spend it anyway, that's a crime. Now, that's not the same as having a line of credit mistakenly opened, but there's some logic to it being a crime.

If $2 million suddenly appeared in your account tomorrow, and you spend it, that's fraud.

If you ask the bank for $2 million, they say "Sure!", and you spend it, that's not fraud.

Re: The bank lent me $2m so I spent it on strippers and cars

#129

Post by FireBeyond »

pktgen wrote: post #102
adekok wrote: post #51

The article doesn't way why he was found not guilty, but I'll make my guess. He did nothing to defraud the bank or mislead it. He simply had access to a large line of credit, and used it. If the bank wants it's money back, that's a civil matter, not a criminal one. It's their responsibility to ask for it back. This reeks of incompetence on the part of the bank, followed by outright malice. They put an innocent guy in…

> He did nothing to defraud the bank or mislead it. He simply had access to a large line of credit, and used it. If the bank wants it's money back, that's a civil matter, not a criminal one. It's their responsibility to ask for it back. He was drawing on this line of credit, which he knew he was legally obligated to pay back, without ever intending to pay it back. That sure seems like fraud to me. There is a differen…

The charge he faced wasn't fraud, but that of "dishonestly obtaining financial advantage by deception", which has a number of different facets to fraud. I think his "Oh, I just kept asking for more" thing doesn't really pass the smell test.

Re: The bank lent me $2m so I spent it on strippers and cars

#130

Post by [deleted] »

mikeash wrote: post #95
TAForObvReasons wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No, there was not a single piece of bad luck for him in this whole affair. Something strange happened to him, but it was easy to handle without screwing anything up: just tell the bank they messed up, or even just ignore it. Deciding to start spending the money like crazy was not bad luck, it was bad judgment. There's another way to look at it: The "bad judgment" is only bad if you view the standard as "tell[ing] t…

I'm not sure what your point is. I mean, you're right, but why would I view the standard that way?

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