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Yahoo installed a backdoor for the NSA behind the back of the security team

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Re: Yahoo installed a backdoor for the NSA behind the back of the security team

#201

Post by brazzledazzle »

avdempsey wrote: post #141
uiri wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given its government's track record, I would think that data centers in the US should be walled off in much the same way as data centers in China. It is frankly surprising that American companies are blind to their own government's track record for indiscriminately spying on its citizens and people around the world.

You mean American companies like Apple? Whether you trust them or not they've certainly brought it up. Though they might not label the spying indiscriminate; maybe still 'criminate. Or are Chinese companies doing some interesting walling-off?

Google encrypting traffic flowing between data centers seems to reflect significant awareness of the issue too.

Re: Yahoo installed a backdoor for the NSA behind the back of the security team

#202

Post by jstanley »

coldcode wrote: post #184
benevol wrote: post #145

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'd be surprised that there are still (technically competent) HN users who seem to be that naive. Or to promote gv't propaganda. Our only solution is to go 100% open-source and 100% end-to-end encryption.

And the government has the power to ban open source and encrypted communications. It's not really all that difficult, if you eliminate any concern for the constitution. If all else fails, rubber hoses and bullets work well.

That won't work. People will just do it anyway. Just look at how well alcohol prohibition worked.

That's part of the beauty of open source - once the cat is out of the bag, there is no getting it back in.

Re: Yahoo installed a backdoor for the NSA behind the back of the security team

#203

Post by Fnoord »

ronreiter wrote: post #97
lazaroclapp wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right ." - Carl Schurz Also, by that logic, any H1B worker that refuses to spy on his company on behalf of his country of citizenship would be a traitor. Do you really want that to be the operative ethics when most S.V. companies are made from people from all over the world? Because I certainly do not.

You don't have to be part of it. If you find out that you are part of it then just quit. But by blowing the whistle you endanger thousands of lives, and you think that just because you're some sort of freedom fighter then it's OK. It's not OK. You want to fight the freedom fight? Go work in politics. Don't screw your own country. BTW - I'm not from the US.

> It's not OK. You want to fight the freedom fight? Go work in politics. Don't screw your own country.

Except, whistleblowing generally doesn't work like that.

It is not as if someone joins an organisation with the intention of blowing the whistle.

If you look into the story of a whistleblower (countless of examples available), you'll see they're just hard working employees who work for their employee, and who stand behind their employee (regardless of if the employee is a government or a company or an NGO). What happens then, is the person decides to become a whistleblower because if this is being cover-up or silenced, it is wrong. IOW, they notice wrong doings the general public ought to know.

Lets forget all the obvious examples of Binney, Snowden, Manning, and the like. Take for example the whistleblowing on Jacob Appelbaum alleged sexual harassment. Those people who blowed the whistle weren't "out to get him". As far as they were concerned they never wanted to blow a whistle, and just lead a happy (employed/) life and their current employer.

Even someone like Assange 'grew into it' somehow, and he's both an outlier and an agent _for_ whistleblowers.

[] Or, if not being paid, volunteer.

Re: Yahoo installed a backdoor for the NSA behind the back of the security team

#204

Post by csomar »

_puk wrote: post #149
Animats wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a large company, a useful thing to do if something fishy is going on is to go see the company's general counsel.[1] If they didn't know about it, they should be told. Their job is to keep the company out of legal trouble. In many cases they have a legal obligation to do something about it. An attorney will rarely tell you to do something illegal; they can be disbarred for that. If they tell you it's OK, then they'…

I'd suggest following up any conversation of substance with general counsel (or even the likes of HR for that matter) with an email detailing the conversation you just had. Don't do it in an obtuse manner; let them know in advance that you will be sending it following the meeting, maybe even get them to suggest the wording of it if you aren't convinced of the security of internal mail. It's easy for either side to fo…

But wait! The emails are being intercepted by the NSA and CIA...

Re: Yahoo installed a backdoor for the NSA behind the back of the security team

#206

Post by mikegioia »

milansuk wrote: post #185

I'm wondering what will happen? More users will start using decentralized and open source programs? They will run their own mail server? Or They will hate NSA, but still push personal data to few big corporations?

Nothing will happen. "Users" don't even know what the majority of these things are, and this concern certainly doesn't even fly on their radar.

I've spent 5 years now on this very topic and my conclusion is that the people just don't give a shit.

Re: Yahoo installed a backdoor for the NSA behind the back of the security team

#207

Post by Raphmedia »

stefek99 wrote: post #190

Ever since I started using email I though law enforcement has continuous, uninterrupted access to my communication. News like this are no news to me :)

I browse assuming that I always have someone over my shoulder.

Re: Yahoo installed a backdoor for the NSA behind the back of the security team

#209

Post by Clubber »

walrus01 wrote: post #22

I seriously think that to get a CS or EE degree (or similar) B.Sci degree, you should be required to take at least one full term length ethics course. Same idea as the ethics courses taught to junior law students. The internet is already fucked up enough with governments and rogue corporations messing with its AS-adjacency topology in non-free ways at OSI layers 1-3 , before you even get into stuff like writing backd…

For what it's worth, Ethics was a required course for an undergrad business degree in my college in the 90s. I'm not sure if it still is.

Ethics is easily thrown out the window once some executives falsely proclaim that they are required by law to do what's best for shareholders. Since shareholders have a minimal voice outside large holders, it's easy for those executives to claim, "the shareholders want profits, period." Of course, they don't mention that executives want bonuses too.

An interesting thing about ethics when you study History. When asked how they could indiscriminately kill Jews during the Holocaust, Nazis usually claimed the first few times were difficult, but the acts became a matter of course; normal as anything else in their day. In that same war, the Soviets committed brutal atrocities of the German cities they conquered, as did the Japanese in China. Every country has committed heinous acts in their history. Once it starts, inhumanity can spread like wildfire.

We as developed world citizens believe we are civilized, and for the most part we are; but we are only a stones throw away from being capable of casually committing what we would think of as atrocities as the norm.

Re: Yahoo installed a backdoor for the NSA behind the back of the security team

#210

Post by ams6110 »

smokeyj wrote: post #85
wildmusings wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want to quit to refuse to help, fine, but I take serious issue with what you're suggesting beyond that. These are the legal actions of the United States government, executing the authority given to them to the people's elected representatives, and overseen by a judiciary duly selected according the constitutional procedures. Their legal and democratic authority is unassailable. Further, you don't know what mot…

> You could be impeding the investigation into a deadly plot. We have warrants for that. Subpoena Yahoo for specific records. I'm not willing to trade the freedom of an entire country for a single investigation. This isn't an episode of 24 and there is no Jack Bauer. The fourth amendment was sold as follows: > The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable sea…

George W? He's been out of the picture for coming up on a decade. There's another guy in there now who could have fixed all this, if he wanted to.
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