Please Jobhop as much as Possible • Hacker News Board

Re: Please Jobhop as much as Possible

#21

Post by leftnode » Tue, May 04, 2010, 2:01 PM UTC

I guess I have a younger point of view, but it pains me to see people stay with a single company all their lives, it just seems like such a waste. They've dedicated their lives to making someone else richer is what it seems to me.

The last company I worked for went under, and when I was searching for a new job, I interviewed with the corporation Conn's (similar to BestBuy/Fry's). I met one well paid executive there who had worked there for the last 25 years. While well compensated, he looked beaten down, way older than he really was, and unhealthy.

The point of life is not dedication to one or multiple companies. That just sounds horrible to me.

Re: Please Jobhop as much as Possible

#22

Post by j_baker » Tue, May 04, 2010, 2:09 PM UTC

driekken wrote: post #2

The whole concept of loyalty towards a corporation is off. You can have loyalty to family, to friends, to a country but never to an economic entity whose only purpose (on paper) is profit. I think that professionalism and well-defined internal rules should be the only things expected by employers.

Sure you can be loyal to a corporation. Just like you can be loyal to your government or customers can be loyal to you. The real problem is when you're asked to put loyalty to the company above all else.

Re: Please Jobhop as much as Possible

#23

Post by pw0ncakes » Tue, May 04, 2010, 2:10 PM UTC

When older people complain about supposedly whiny, entitled, self-centered and disloyal young people, exactly one work comes to mind: Projection.

We came of age while society fell apart. We're in our 20s and won't be able to own a house or have children until our mid-30s, due to the still-absurd housing costs, absent job security, and lack of a decent health care system.

The Boomers were born into an affluent, forward-looking society in which it was embarrassingly easy to advance. You could be a pot-smoking hippie dropout at Woodstock in '69 and a CEO by '75, whereas we have to start racking up internships (unpaid, in most industries) in high school. They inherited a society that would go forward and achieve great things so long as no one came along and fucked it up (as the Reaganites did). We inherited a giant, potentially intractable, mess.

Re: Please Jobhop as much as Possible

#24

Post by billybob » Tue, May 04, 2010, 2:10 PM UTC

kznewman wrote: post #3

driekken wrote: post #2

The whole concept of loyalty towards a corporation is off. You can have loyalty to family, to friends, to a country but never to an economic entity whose only purpose (on paper) is profit. I think that professionalism and well-defined internal rules should be the only things expected by employers.

In the main I agree, but despite the buzzwords if the corporation really believes and acts as if "employees are the most important asset" and it truly gets that to be profitable it needs to take care of the "knowledge workers" (whatever that means) then it may be that some companies, because of their profit motive, are worthy of some loyalty. Most companies fall short of the ideal so professionalism is more than a se…

Yes - if my employer is loyal to me, I feel more inclined to be loyal to them. If they make it clear that they'll fire anyone, anytime, as soon as profits drop, then I'm happy moving on whenever I please.

Re: Please Jobhop as much as Possible

#25

Post by j_baker » Tue, May 04, 2010, 2:13 PM UTC

DanielBMarkham wrote: post #9

I feel somewhat passionately about this, and I've always thought this job-hopping debate was extremely skewed. There are people who want loyalty and dedication above all else -- both from themselves and from their workers and employers. Then there are people who want challenge, risk, excitement, and travel. From what I've seen, if you want to learn meta-tech (and not just tech in your neck of the woods) you need to g…

Just out of curiosity, what exactly do you do? Do you do consulting?

Re: Please Jobhop as much as Possible

#26

Post by billybob » Tue, May 04, 2010, 2:14 PM UTC

This should be taken with a grain of salt. Yes, change jobs enough to get lots of experience and pay raises. Don't get stagnant somewhere.

But imagine you never stay more than 6 months! Potential employers may think "is it worth our time to train this person before he/she leaves? And is he/she too fickle to accomplish anything?"

Re: Please Jobhop as much as Possible

#27

Post by hello_moto » Tue, May 04, 2010, 2:19 PM UTC

DanielBMarkham wrote: post #9

I feel somewhat passionately about this, and I've always thought this job-hopping debate was extremely skewed. There are people who want loyalty and dedication above all else -- both from themselves and from their workers and employers. Then there are people who want challenge, risk, excitement, and travel. From what I've seen, if you want to learn meta-tech (and not just tech in your neck of the woods) you need to g…

There might be exceptions. For example: the government. Unfortunately to get those jobs, candidates must have experience in SAP HR, PeopleSoft, Oracle Financials. Probably a good plan nearing retirement (i.e. when you're 45-47 years old).

Re: Please Jobhop as much as Possible

#28

Post by hello_moto » Tue, May 04, 2010, 2:19 PM UTC

Love your job but do not fall in love to your company.

On the other hand, where I live, one must switch job to get a better/increase pay. Yes, sad.

Re: Please Jobhop as much as Possible

#29

Post by billybob » Tue, May 04, 2010, 2:20 PM UTC

Mc_Big_G wrote: post #15

I recently had a conversation with my 16 year old son who was having girl problems. Part of my advice was about playing the field. i.e. "What are the chances the best woman for you, in all the world, lives 1/4 mile away?" Similarly, what are the chances the best job for you is your first, or second, or third? Slim. Playing the field with employers should be the standard mode of operation. This possibly benefits emplo…

It's your kid, but I'd temper the advice with this:

1)There's no such thing as the perfect mate. Looking for perfection will make you dissatisfied with everyone you date. 2) A lot of what makes a relationship work or fail is how you treat each other, not who you're with. 3) "Playing the field" too much desensitizes you. Your memories with your mate are mingled and confused with memories of lots of others. You keep doing mental comparisons. You have fewer unique experiences together. It just seems less special. So look around, sure - but don't make a sport of it. Lasting love is way more satisfying than a lifetime of flings.

(Employment, of course, is totally different.)

Re: Please Jobhop as much as Possible

#30

Post by hello_moto » Tue, May 04, 2010, 2:28 PM UTC

pw0ncakes wrote: post #23

When older people complain about supposedly whiny, entitled, self-centered and disloyal young people, exactly one work comes to mind: Projection. We came of age while society fell apart. We're in our 20s and won't be able to own a house or have children until our mid-30s, due to the still-absurd housing costs, absent job security, and lack of a decent health care system. The Boomers were born into an affluent, forwar…

I somewhat agree with your statement while I can't explain what's going on in this world we live today.

There are many CEO out there that read or listen advises on how to make sure their company "lean, mean, and profitable" by laying off people or pushing them to work for more hours and pay less under whatever reason.

I'm not asking the leader of companies to pay younger generations more money, at least treat us decent, provide us with trainings (how many companies do give new grad/hire trainings these days?).

While I don't mind with below average pay (just not too much), I would hope a bit of compensation in the form of trainings, advancements, bonuses (bigger than 3-5%), etc.