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Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf]

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Re: Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf]

#31
Warning! /r/iamverysmart post ahead! I normally wouldn't engage in this, as it's extremely poor manners and terribly arrogant, but it's on topic here and I think other potential /r/iamverysmart posters might benefit, so here goes:

One of the problems of being intelligent is learning how to tolerate and accept boredom. I used to rebel against being bored and being ahead of the class. I would think: "this is all so easy and why isn't anybody interested in anything interesting?"

Once I learned that dealing with boredom is basically the price you pay for fitting in things improved a lot. I deal with a lot of friendships that are profoundly boring just so I can have people to talk to and socially interact with. I don't complain. I don't patronize. I just go through the motions so I can cargo cult my way to a social life. I lowered my expectations on everything and everybody to absolutely nothing and it works great.

I overhear other people's conversations and I think to myself: "how can these people even put up with that level of conversation?. They must be pretending to be entertained!" Then I remember all about the boring world out there where people go about their daily lives talking all day about boring stuff.

After all this boring interaction I'll occasionally go to a Deep Learning study group and we'll read the latest paper. Very smart people will analyze the paper and leave me a little disconcerted that there are people that I can engage with intellectually and be challenged and entertained by in a sincere way. Anyway, that's just my two cents about the world for the disgruntled /r/iamverysmart crowd out there, whether you actually are or not. :)

Re: Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf]

#32
post #2

From a limited dataset: They get by. Find balance. When you ask them for a coffee, they tell you they don't have the $5 to take the subway to meet you and are very sorry for that. Some have other problems they are trying to work around, and all their energy goes to that and not inventing the next quantum equation. They drop out of being the hottest developers in the software industry, they stop being the top performe…

Author of the article here: yes, the most interesting question is, what can we do to help? The article makes some suggestions. Short version: Spread awareness, especially among professionals (medical doctors, psychiatrists, etc). I have seen lots of high-IQ/highly sensitive people who got terrible advice from psychologists and psychiatrists. Educate those professionals, so at least they don't do any damage. Also: a c…

This is a crude analogy, but a high IQ is in itself the same as having a certain gene, or genes. A marker of potential for something, but environment/nature is such as or more important. Nature in this case would be social environment, if we are talking about social/life success etc. And social/life success is tied far more strongly to emotional IQ. I'm up there at the far end of the IQ scale, but at this point in my life, I can see that all the trouble I've had in life is due to the emotional IQ part. And that was all due to the psychological environment I had to grow up in.

Those anecdotes are bereft of real details, but I think it is safe to assume those people, because of their home environment, didn't grow up with to deal with the issues of dealing with society in some manner. Society, is .. well, once you grasp psychology and how primate societies operate, the stupidity of humanity makes sense. It doesn't excuse it, but that is humanity for you. You just learn not to expect the ideal, as simple as it may seem to one smarter than average. An understanding of Buddhism helps.

The fact that psychotherapy etc didn't help shouldn't serve as a condemnation of the profession entirely, but just the fact that an awful lot of therapists are incompetent. I think I was lucky, I had mostly good ones. they didn't help solve everything, but each provided the support to get ahold of the next piece of the puzzle.

Even then, with a good therapist, it still takes some sort of inner resolve to fully transcend one's emotional pain. I have no good advice on this other than keep trying and learn enough psychology/psychiatry so you can spot the idiots. One you learn how to start playing psychotherapist with yourself, it becomes easier.

Suggestions? Some sort of group therapy model re: a platform would be an idea. Group therapy was very useful for me. I could see the problems I wrestled with mirrored in the problems others wrestled with - the guy that had a personality fundamentally like mine was ... the details were different, but the themes were the same. You wouldn't want a platform for people to just reinforce their complaining or poor me attitude. i.e. no friendships or socializing developing out of it. OTOH, text only communication is bad for this sort of thing. A group video conference might be workable, but I don't know, there are logistical problems I think. But I am somewhat biased, given what I know and have found useful.

Re: Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf]

#33
Interesting read.

Personally, I feel like I'm somewhere on this spectrum, but perhaps not as far along as your two examples. Depending on my choices over the next couple years, it could go either way, I think.

I have terrible OCD and anxiety, and usually spend 1-2 days a week dealing with that problem alone. But thankfully my job is flexible and well-paid enough that I can still live pretty comfortably.

More than anything else (and embarrassingly), I sympathize with your examples' misanthropy and consequent social isolation.

In my opinion, being almost completely subject to disciplinary structures such as work and school for most of their lives makes most people pretty uninteresting. I can't say that I've done lots of super interesting things myself (working on it!), but unfortunately that doesn't really help me feel better about my peers.

I also dislike the kind of social interactions social media seems to encourage. For me, the need to constantly seek or maintain approval of a wide audience of people is extremely unbecoming. Being an introvert, I also can't really deal with the 'little bits of social interaction sprinkled over time' pattern. But unfortunately, it seems that social media now dominates patterns of social relations, so it seems that I have to deal with that somehow...

Re: Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf]

#34
I think introversion may be partly to blame. I can relate to a lot of the things about the people in this article.

That said, over many years, I managed to train myself to act extroverted. Recently, someone even accused me of being a "social, networking type" which they probably meant as an insult but it was actually a massive compliment to my life's work ;p

Re: Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf]

#35

Warning! /r/iamverysmart post ahead! I normally wouldn't engage in this, as it's extremely poor manners and terribly arrogant, but it's on topic here and I think other potential /r/iamverysmart posters might benefit, so here goes: One of the problems of being intelligent is learning how to tolerate and accept boredom. I used to rebel against being bored and being ahead of the class. I would think: "this is all so eas…

Finding something to do with the spare cycles is definitely one problem that has to be solved.

Re: Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf]

#36

I know of at least two other people from small towns whose IQ and life stories are similar to those shared in the article. I think high IQ individuals becoming isolated, social outcasts is more common in small towns, where accelerated curriculums and gifted and talented programs are more rare. If you know a highly gifted child, refer them to the Davidson Academy, a free public school for the profoundly gifted. http:/…

Got any resources for preschools?

I've got a serious pending problem with my youngest. She's 18 months old and already on par with an average 4-5 year old (and even older in some ways). It's really freaking my wife and I out - we cannot keep up with her curiosity and motivation to learn - we just don't have time or resources. We're worried that by the time she starts school, she's going to be so far ahead that she won't be able to relate to the other kids. She already has issues with other 18-24 month olds - she call's them babies and treats them like so. No idea what to do.

I just want her to be able to hang out with kids like herself and do what kids do. I'm not interested in turning her into a super-genius or putting pressure or her or training her or any of that. I'd rather her just be free and follow her mind for as long as possible.

Re: Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf]

#37
post #15

Teachers disliked him, because they knew how easily he picked up information. I'm a teacher, and this is one of the things that frustrates me deeply about our education system. I welcome students like this; they're so much fun to work with. But I usually have to make them feel accepted before I can begin to work with them. I teach in a small alternative high school, and by the time bright students get to me, they're…

You are taking that quote way out of context the next part of the sentence "but then he never made an effort to improve his grades" is the relevant part. They dislike him because he didn't try to improve not because he was good at picking up information.

[deleted]

Re: Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf]

#38

Is the focus on "High IQ" helpful here? Why would the treatment for ADHD, Depression, Social Anxiety, etc, be any different for them than someone with a lower IQ?

Because in some cases it's none of the above; it's just not fitting in, and getting "treated" for being different is often the beginning of a long and sad history of self-blame and isolation.

Re: Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf]

#39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are taking that quote way out of context the next part of the sentence "but then he never made an effort to improve his grades" is the relevant part. They dislike him because he didn't try to improve not because he was good at picking up information.

In fact that may be the curse of the smart kid - things come so easily they won't put in effort when it is required. They become lazy.

This was my story. I wouldn't even say I'm particularly "smart", just clever enough to not need to work very hard at much until late high school. BC calc kicked in, all of a sudden I was failing a class for the first time. College kicked in, all of a sudden I was getting low grades even in my strengths. It took a year of that before I even learned the most rudimentary patterns of studying and practice, and over a decade (still learning) to bake those patterns into my day to day behavior.

What makes me very sad, as a slightly tangential note, my university had covered grades first semester freshman year. This let me do terribly, learn from that experience, and not have it impact my future prospects. They've since removed that, and I honestly feel sorry for new generations of students to have one less helpful safety net. With a good support system in place to help recovery, the chance to fail (in a scenario that would be "non-terminal") has been critical to my learning to suck less across the board.

Re: Where Do the Failed 0.1% Go? (2015) [pdf]

#40

I know of at least two other people from small towns whose IQ and life stories are similar to those shared in the article. I think high IQ individuals becoming isolated, social outcasts is more common in small towns, where accelerated curriculums and gifted and talented programs are more rare. If you know a highly gifted child, refer them to the Davidson Academy, a free public school for the profoundly gifted. http:/…

> online options as well. fairly certain this is the opposite of what they need

You should sit a genius 10 year old with no social skills in a class of 20 somethings? That seems not a path to success.
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