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Want a Job in Silicon Valley? Keep Away from Coding Schools

bloomberg.com

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Re: Want a Job in Silicon Valley? Keep Away from Coding Schools

#11

Post by carc »

burger_moon wrote: post #8

I went to one and now a couple years in I'm working at one of the "big 4" companies. It worked out for me but I still wouldn't recommend them to other people. It only worked for me because it helped lay the groundwork but I put in countless hours every night studying and getting better while working as well. Too many of my former classmates graduated and expected that to be the end of the hard work, like they were no…

Funny, I have almost the exact same experience. Quit my job as a CPA at a big firm to go to a coding bootcamp, made myself put in the same number of hours coding/learning as I was working my old job (70+/week) until I found a job... got a job at a startup first and 2 years later got a job at one of the "big 4".

I also don't list my bootcamp anywhere mostly because I'm worried about assumptions people will make about my technical knowledge if I do (rather than judging based on my actual performance). I'm also hesitant to recommend it to others because while I have to say it was 100% worth it to me... I've tried to help too many people learn to code who just failed because they weren't willing to fight past the frustrations of the learning curve (which is very steep at first). I just assume now that most people don't have what it takes (and that is NOT intelligence or cleverness... it's mostly just discipline/work ethic/intellectual curiosity).. so I'll never really encourage people to follow my path.

Re: Want a Job in Silicon Valley? Keep Away from Coding Schools

#12

Post by tannhauser23 »

carc wrote: post #11
burger_moon wrote: post #8

I went to one and now a couple years in I'm working at one of the "big 4" companies. It worked out for me but I still wouldn't recommend them to other people. It only worked for me because it helped lay the groundwork but I put in countless hours every night studying and getting better while working as well. Too many of my former classmates graduated and expected that to be the end of the hard work, like they were no…

Funny, I have almost the exact same experience. Quit my job as a CPA at a big firm to go to a coding bootcamp, made myself put in the same number of hours coding/learning as I was working my old job (70+/week) until I found a job... got a job at a startup first and 2 years later got a job at one of the "big 4". I also don't list my bootcamp anywhere mostly because I'm worried about assumptions people will make about…

I also transitioned from a professional services career to programming through a bootcamp. When others ask me for advice, I only recommend the bootcamps that have a rigorous precourse/admissions process. And even then, I tell them it's a really difficult process to graduate and find a job afterwards, and that they better be ready for six to nine months of hard work and financial uncertainty.

In the end, it was totally worth it for me and I couldn't be happier!

Re: Want a Job in Silicon Valley? Keep Away from Coding Schools

#13

Post by sfrailsdev »

HillaryBriss wrote: post #4

i remember hearing about a coding school that was charging something close to fifteen thousand dollars for a course on programming Android apps. the company claimed to have some kind of special relationship with Google. but the course curriculum was apparently homegrown from nothing. very little actual input from Google. and i remember wondering "what's the special understanding, the inside track, the competitive edg…

I think Udacity had a claim like that for a nano degree.

Re: Want a Job in Silicon Valley? Keep Away from Coding Schools

#14

Post by dvdhnt »

carc wrote: post #11
burger_moon wrote: post #8

I went to one and now a couple years in I'm working at one of the "big 4" companies. It worked out for me but I still wouldn't recommend them to other people. It only worked for me because it helped lay the groundwork but I put in countless hours every night studying and getting better while working as well. Too many of my former classmates graduated and expected that to be the end of the hard work, like they were no…

Funny, I have almost the exact same experience. Quit my job as a CPA at a big firm to go to a coding bootcamp, made myself put in the same number of hours coding/learning as I was working my old job (70+/week) until I found a job... got a job at a startup first and 2 years later got a job at one of the "big 4". I also don't list my bootcamp anywhere mostly because I'm worried about assumptions people will make about…

> Funny, I have almost the exact same experience.

I left the world of government contracting to attend a code school on the east coast. Now, I'm on my second year of my second startup, and truthfully, I've learned more here than at code school. Not because the school was terrible, but due to the dynamic environment.

When I left code school, there's zero percent chance I could have successfully deployed one of my applications containerized, secured, scalable, etc. However, after working here, I either (a) know how to do step X or (b) can successfully read documentation and use context clues (or ask peers for help).

To your point, I have trouble recommending code school to friends and family. It's not that I don't value what I learned, but I can't compare my intelligence/persistence/etc to theirs, I wouldn't know how. I haven't worked for one of the "big 4" although I did interview with Google and am in consistent contact with Amazon.

I've always wanted to get together with other code school graduates and develop material for graduates focusing on different areas in more depth, specifically I believe more information on databases, production environments, and open source would be highly beneficial to alumni. After code school, there's a lot of knowing about some topic, but it's so much more important to understand that topic, IMHO.

Re: Want a Job in Silicon Valley? Keep Away from Coding Schools

#15

Post by jc_811 »

said one reason he chose the school was it said its instruction included a software language called PHP. Halfway through the course, when he asked when they would start learning PHP, he said he was told the school had scrapped plans to teach it

This right here I think is the biggest problem with coding bootcamps. Many novices go in thinking that they need to learn a cool/new/useful language - and then they will find a job in it (after all, the job boards rave about experiences with specific languages).

However, learning how to code is not learning a coding language. Learning a language is almost secondary to learning underlying CS concepts. It's not as sexy to say "learn algorithm design and garbage collection" no matter how necessary it is.

I feel many students go into these bootcamps thinking that learning a language and syntax is the most important software skill to have. However, when a company has to decide between someone from a 3 month javascript bootcamp, or someone with a CS degree - the decision is easy. We need to start preaching that learning to code and building software skills is totally language agnostic - and the underlying concepts are by far more important.

Re: Want a Job in Silicon Valley? Keep Away from Coding Schools

#17

Post by serge2k »

srebalaji wrote: post #16

Why can't people learn from online courses provided by treehouse or codeschool or udemy. There are cheaper when compared to coding bootcamps. Anyone care to comment ?

Some people find it easier to learn in a structured environment.

Re: Want a Job in Silicon Valley? Keep Away from Coding Schools

#18

Post by 40acres »

So how would one go about getting a job in the Valley? I'm a dev w/ 3 years experience. Google and Facebook reached out to me for interviews but I couldn't pass the phone screen. I don't need a bootcamp, but I'm not exactly sure how to prepare for a modern day technical interview.

PS. I don't aspire to work in the valley per se, but I've failed multiple technical interviews with a variety of companies, if I ever want to earn another job I feel like I'd have to learn how to work w the system.

Re: Want a Job in Silicon Valley? Keep Away from Coding Schools

#19

Post by subway »

40acres wrote: post #18

So how would one go about getting a job in the Valley? I'm a dev w/ 3 years experience. Google and Facebook reached out to me for interviews but I couldn't pass the phone screen. I don't need a bootcamp, but I'm not exactly sure how to prepare for a modern day technical interview. PS. I don't aspire to work in the valley per se, but I've failed multiple technical interviews with a variety of companies, if I ever want…

How do you go about getting a job anywhere else?

You research companies that share your values/goals, then start a conversation with them.

Re: Want a Job in Silicon Valley? Keep Away from Coding Schools

#20

Post by mmoroz »

pinewurst wrote: post #7

That's a long hard fall for Tony Fadell, from the pinnacle of autocratic Googliness to doing promo videos for dodgy coding schools.

Nah, that one is a free school, funded as charity by a French billionaire. It charges no fees or commission. It's been "promoted" (for free of course) by many top silicon valley business people and engineers: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/42_(school)#Endorsement. Check your facts before saying bad things about people.
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