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Tell HN: Political Detox Week – No politics on HN for one week

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Re: Tell HN: Political Detox Week – No politics on HN for one week

#841

Post by chillwaves »

bmelton wrote: post #795
_qc3o wrote: post #524

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Talk is cheap and political discussion is especially cheap. How do you propose to lead constructive discussions around these matters that will lead to actionable items for cleaning up the mess? From what I have seen I don't think HN in its current form is the right forum for those discussions. Even scanning this sub-thread prompted by your comment I'm already starting to see that the discussion seems to be devolving.…

> Talk is cheap and political discussion is especially cheap. How do you propose to lead constructive discussions around these matters I don't know about 'actionable items', but political conversation isn't any different than other conversations -- civility, the assumption of good faith, and an open mind are more common factors as to whether a discussion is good or bad versus topic. The problem with political discuss…

Don't you think your post rings of false equivalency? How do you discuss in "good faith" ideas like white nationalism?

Re: Tell HN: Political Detox Week – No politics on HN for one week

#842

Post by chillwaves »

hueving wrote: post #597
ajamesm wrote: post #586

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is it "assumption and hyperbole" to take statements at face value? The incoming administration is on the record with their intents.

When the statements themselves are hyperbole. Look at how many details about the wall have changed. I don't understand why people on the left assume he was lying all of the times he delivered toned down statements and was only telling the truth when at the most extreme.

> I don't understand why people on the left assume [that Trump is dangerous and unpredictable and changes his mind more often than a traffic light].

Make sense now?

Re: Tell HN: Political Detox Week – No politics on HN for one week

#844

Post by chillwaves »

saalweachter wrote: post #785
ucarion wrote: post #647

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This moratorium will only last a week. I think our discourse will survive. Though political discussion is essential, I think you'd agree it has downsides when there's too much of it or when everyone considers it high-stakes. The way I see it, the mods are asking us all to hold our political tongues and see what the comments feel like. They're very clear that it's an experiment. Maybe when politics resume seven days f…

But politics is high-stakes. How could it be otherwise? It is deciding what we, as a people, want to be.

Some people have more at stake than others.

Re: Tell HN: Political Detox Week – No politics on HN for one week

#845

Post by Jarwain »

mattnewton wrote: post #232
chrissnell wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I fully support this detox week. As someone whose political views don't align with the average HN reader, I often feel marginalized by unfair downvoting in political discussion, even though I have made my points in an informed and respectful way. It often feels like there is one prevailing slant on this site and those of the majority are free to push their views while the rest of us must either read it and ignore it…

The rub is, a lot of difficult conversations lead to what are effectively political answers. Take the amazon go which is on the front page right now. We need to be able to have a conversation about job displacing technologies, and hacker news has been a good venue for smart, civilized discussion on the topic. I'm all for flagging uncivilized discussions, but eliminating discussions outright because they might make pe…

I wouldn't think that a conversation about job displacing tech would be against the rules/political. I'd think that it would get political, in the sense that detox week is trying to avoid, if discussion turns to the president-elect or "partisan politics"

Re: Tell HN: Political Detox Week – No politics on HN for one week

#846

Post by joshkpeterson »

lobotryas wrote: post #813
flashman wrote: post #561

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not to mention that "can we please stop with all the politics" is not political neutrality , it's a position that supports the status quo. Silence assists certain forms of repression.

How can you come to such a conclusion? "Can we stop with the politics" doesn't take away your right to protest or discuss politics _elsewhere_. It just means someone is tired hearing the same arguments rehashed over and over on HN.

Yes, but there are issues (mainly relating to surveillance, economic inequality, climate change, and racial justice) that intersect with what we discuss here on HN in ways that will affect millions of people's lives. We need to talk it out.

Re: Tell HN: Political Detox Week – No politics on HN for one week

#847

Post by polymotivated »

dragonwriter wrote: post #839
polymotivated wrote: post #832

Here's an idea. If a story is clearly political, then just turn off comment moderation except for flagging. Objectively, HN has a huge problem with leftists and socialists downvoting conservative/libertarian comments. Dang knows this. I haven't read all the comments, but if he denies that simple fact, then HN has bigger problems. You can't have legitimate conversations if the other side is openly hostile to the very…

> Objectively, HN has a huge problem with leftists and socialists downvoting conservative/libertarian comments It's funny how partisans on the right often say this, and partisans on the left often say the same thing, with the sides reversed. The fact is, HN has sizable and active contigents from all parts if the political spectrum, and partisan voting (up and down) comes from all sides.

Maybe those on the right aren't as trigger-happy with the down-votes as the leftists are. Leftists aren't so keen on free speech anyway. Just look at the SJWs and the global warming crowd.

Re: Tell HN: Political Detox Week – No politics on HN for one week

#848

Post by goalieca »

reflexive wrote: post #409
nneonneo wrote: post #174

Many of the top-level comments here are against this move. I, on the other hand, would like to express my strong support for this move. Hacker News has never been an anything-goes site. Tight moderation, considerate rules, and low tolerance for bullshit have made this a great site to talk about interesting technical topics and ideas. Remember that we all abide by the rules of the site, and that this isn't a magic fre…

Political discourse is antithetical to rational, intelligent discussion. In fact, what is antithetical to rational, intelligent discussion is: emotionally charged, poorly-considered, and dishonest discussion. The topic doesn't matter: health fads, operating systems, or taxes. I agree, many people have terrible style in their approach to political discussion - but see also, e.g. Hobbes and Rousseau for more thoughtful…

Agreed. The recent hate for apple is such an instance of this phenomenon. Every day i see posts about how horrible the new macbook pros are. It's just a damn computer people!

Re: Tell HN: Political Detox Week – No politics on HN for one week

#849

Post by inimino »

chrissnell wrote: post #205
tarikjn wrote: post #62

I find this experiment a bit strange/disturbing, avoiding political subjects is a way of putting the head in the sand. HN is a community of hackers and entrepreneurs and politics affects these subjects one way or another wether we want to avoid it or not, and are an important component of entrepreneurial and technical subjects. It might be fine if HN was a scientific community, but it is not the case, and even then p…

I fully support this detox week. As someone whose political views don't align with the average HN reader, I often feel marginalized by unfair downvoting in political discussion, even though I have made my points in an informed and respectful way. It often feels like there is one prevailing slant on this site and those of the majority are free to push their views while the rest of us must either read it and ignore it…

Rational, polite, constructive, civil, objective discourse is possible on any topic. It just gets a lot harder.

Re: Tell HN: Political Detox Week – No politics on HN for one week

#850

Post by grzm »

polymotivated wrote: post #847
dragonwriter wrote: post #839

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Objectively, HN has a huge problem with leftists and socialists downvoting conservative/libertarian comments It's funny how partisans on the right often say this, and partisans on the left often say the same thing, with the sides reversed. The fact is, HN has sizable and active contigents from all parts if the political spectrum, and partisan voting (up and down) comes from all sides.

Maybe those on the right aren't as trigger-happy with the down-votes as the leftists are. Leftists aren't so keen on free speech anyway. Just look at the SJWs and the global warming crowd.

These types of generalizations are exactly why political discourse breaks down so quickly, regardless of political stripe. Two comments from an account created just to post them and attack a particular political position: is this the type of honest, nuanced political discussion you hold up as useful? My goodness. Do you want ants? Because that’s how you get ants.
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