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Canadian journalist's detention at US border raises press freedom alarms

nytimes.com

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Re: Canadian journalist's detention at US border raises press freedom alarms

#101

Post by emiliobumachar »

chinathrow wrote: post #36
nostromo wrote: post #3

I'm so embarrassed how America treats people entering the U.S. It's the first experience foreigners have in our country, and we make it one of the worst experiences in the developed world. Industries that benefit from tourism should lobby the Federal Government to improve the travel experience to, from, and within the US. I personally would fly at least a few more times a year if the TSA/CBP process treated people wi…

Even more depressing is the fact that many countries take the US as their idol and start also requiring all 10 finger prints at border crossing. It's an epidemic these days.

Here in Brazil we demand fingerprints only for Americans, as a reciprocity measure. A mix of revenge and incentivising change.

It's controversial, cause it hurts tourism and business.

Re: Canadian journalist's detention at US border raises press freedom alarms

#102

Post by AJ007 »

drvdevd wrote: post #87
toomuchtodo wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't upvote this enough. I'm a law abiding citizen, but I still wipe my phone and restore from iCloud after I've made my way through customs or border control.

Yes and you have to keep in mind that just because someone has the legal authority to seize your posession, you have no reason to trust that what they will do with it will be legal as well. For all you know they can do any number of stupid and/or malicious things with your device that don't reflect the intentions of the government they represent either (being generous here). They are just people, after all.

If you run a startup with millions of users it is reckless to assume you will not be the target of industrial espionage when crossing a foreign border or traveling in a foreign state.

Re: Canadian journalist's detention at US border raises press freedom alarms

#103

Post by eloff »

nostromo wrote: post #3

I'm so embarrassed how America treats people entering the U.S. It's the first experience foreigners have in our country, and we make it one of the worst experiences in the developed world. Industries that benefit from tourism should lobby the Federal Government to improve the travel experience to, from, and within the US. I personally would fly at least a few more times a year if the TSA/CBP process treated people wi…

I specifically pay extra and fly longer to avoid the US when possible because the experience is so bad. That's money the US economy misses out on. Especially since it's much less likely that a US airline is involved.

Re: Canadian journalist's detention at US border raises press freedom alarms

#104

Post by edblarney »

exolymph wrote: post #78
edblarney wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" I'd say, "Okay, I want to talk to the American embassy," then wait it out." You'd be waiting forever.

I doubt it, because it would end up being a PR storm for Canada, just like this event. I have people who would want to know where I was. I might end up waiting weeks or months, though. It's hard to be sure without knowing more about Canadian law and enforcement norms.

No, it would not be a 'PR storm'.

This kind of stuff happens all day, every day, at every one of the major border crossings.

You'd be denied entry and that would be the end of it.

"I might end up waiting weeks or months, though."

The American embassy will tell you there's nothing they can do, and you'd be waiting in perpetuity in a hotel on the American side of the border.

Re: Canadian journalist's detention at US border raises press freedom alarms

#105

Post by delackner »

jliptzin wrote: post #21

Don't be fooled, Canadian border patrol proudly engages in this as well. I was recently driving across the border to Montreal on vacation when Canadian border agents, in addition to searching my car and personal belongings, demanded to see my cell phone and turn over the password. I simply asked why, since I didn't think I was doing anything suspicious, at which point the agent angrily responded "because I can and no…

I'm curious, do you think anything about your appearance or car made them profile you specifically? I crossed over a few years ago at Niagara falls and found the border agents extremely courteous and friendly, probably more so than any other crossing I've made in the world. I mention it not as anecdata, but just to wonder if even the same border agent might treat someone very negatively today (change in policy over time) or simply because they are looking at silly factors like how old your car looks.

Re: Canadian journalist's detention at US border raises press freedom alarms

#106

Post by saycheese »

jliptzin wrote: post #21

Don't be fooled, Canadian border patrol proudly engages in this as well. I was recently driving across the border to Montreal on vacation when Canadian border agents, in addition to searching my car and personal belongings, demanded to see my cell phone and turn over the password. I simply asked why, since I didn't think I was doing anything suspicious, at which point the agent angrily responded "because I can and no…

Are you a journalist?

Re: Canadian journalist's detention at US border raises press freedom alarms

#107

Post by forgetsusername »

exolymph wrote: post #78
edblarney wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" I'd say, "Okay, I want to talk to the American embassy," then wait it out." You'd be waiting forever.

I doubt it, because it would end up being a PR storm for Canada, just like this event. I have people who would want to know where I was. I might end up waiting weeks or months, though. It's hard to be sure without knowing more about Canadian law and enforcement norms.

>I doubt it, because it would end up being a PR storm for Canada, just like this event.

PR Storm? This is the first I've read about it, and it's the NY Times. I don't see anything relating to it on CBC, Globe or National Post sites. Nothing on CBC Radio 1 in my drive to or from work, either.

Re: Canadian journalist's detention at US border raises press freedom alarms

#108

Post by forgetsusername »

rhizome wrote: post #89
jliptzin wrote: post #21

Don't be fooled, Canadian border patrol proudly engages in this as well. I was recently driving across the border to Montreal on vacation when Canadian border agents, in addition to searching my car and personal belongings, demanded to see my cell phone and turn over the password. I simply asked why, since I didn't think I was doing anything suspicious, at which point the agent angrily responded "because I can and no…

"Sorry, I don't remember the passcode," or say the phone isn't yours.

>"Sorry, I don't remember the passcode," or say the phone isn't yours.

Then you get detained. Indefinitely if they believe you to be lying.

Do you think they'll let you go with this excuse?

Re: Canadian journalist's detention at US border raises press freedom alarms

#109

Post by empressplay »

exolymph wrote: post #50
jliptzin wrote: post #21

Don't be fooled, Canadian border patrol proudly engages in this as well. I was recently driving across the border to Montreal on vacation when Canadian border agents, in addition to searching my car and personal belongings, demanded to see my cell phone and turn over the password. I simply asked why, since I didn't think I was doing anything suspicious, at which point the agent angrily responded "because I can and no…

> I asked what would happen if I didn't turn the password over and just went back home to the US, they told me they'd seize the device and put me in prison until they break into it. I guess it depends on how much you care about your personal info or how sensitive your data is, but I wouldn't budge based on this. I'd say, "Okay, I want to talk to the American embassy," then wait it out. Edit: To be clear, this would b…

You're under the mistaken impression that when you enter a border crossing you can turn around and go home without the permission of the country you're attempting to enter.

This is not true. You've already entered the country, and so the border staff (US, Canadian, whoever) can indeed detain you, throw you into immigration detention, take all your stuff, really whatever they want. You don't have any rights. You could call your embassy, but they will tell you that so long as the other country is following its own laws, you're stuck, and they can't help you.

If you don't like it, don't go.

Re: Canadian journalist's detention at US border raises press freedom alarms

#110

Post by tajen »

nostromo wrote: post #3

I'm so embarrassed how America treats people entering the U.S. It's the first experience foreigners have in our country, and we make it one of the worst experiences in the developed world. Industries that benefit from tourism should lobby the Federal Government to improve the travel experience to, from, and within the US. I personally would fly at least a few more times a year if the TSA/CBP process treated people wi…

I confirm: I don't go to USA conferences because of the TSA/CSP. If Europe follows USA with a 15-year delay, I'll either have to stay in France or reconsider my policy.
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