Wrong signal

> This isn't the security community. The security community is pretty much unanimous in supporting Signal over all other secure messengers.

Sorry, but I am still yet to see the proclaimed unanimous support for Signal as a messenger. As a protocol – sure, most infosec professionals obviously support Axolotl, but this does not imply your statement in any way.

> The entities most harshly critical of Signal are supporters of other messaging applications and protocols.

So the support for Signal isn't that “unanimous” after all, is it?

Otherwise, of course they will if they think that Signal has lost the proper direction for some reason (according to their view). Even many protocol supporters prefer using something like WhatsApp or Wire, the former due to its purported network effect and the likes of the latter because of features like E2E encrypted file transfers, 1:1 video or group calls w/o apparent security trade-offs compared to Signal.

> I don't so much care what messaging system you use to talk to your friends or chat with your gaming guild. But if you have real adversaries, the security part of your messaging system has to work, even more than the messaging part. For that situation, Signal is the only messaging system I'd recommend unreservedly.

In the end, it turns out that this is your personal opinion, not that of the security community as a whole (hint: there is none), which is fine if you didn't misrepresent it in most of your post. The networks of other people may or may not choose to go a different way, although some (or even many) of them may support the same core technologies, just because they do not agree with some decisions OWS made along the way and don't want to reconsider for any reason opposing parties have presented, e.g. in articles like the one we are commenting under.

To sum up, feel free to suggest Signal as an instant messenger, but please be careful with your supporting claims because there are other great and upcoming messengers out there like Matrix, Wire, Onion.chat, GNU Ring, any of the mentioned elsewhere Telegram and WhatsApp, or many, many others. Signal has legitimate reasons on its side that will make your argument weigh more than unjustified claims that it should apparently be the end-all and be-all of one's instant messaging needs.

> I do not feel like the FOSS community is a "burden," however I do wish they recognized that many of their desires are unique to a very small minority of Signal users. I wish that they'd take more responsibility for manifesting those desires themselves. > This is the second time in two months that someone from the FOSS scene has written up a list of complaints, but as far as I know, in neither case have the authors ever contributed anything to Signal in an effort to meet their own needs.

I think that the interest in the FOSS community is relatively low given the centralized format in which Signal is offered. I know many people who are deeply into FOSS who would love an alternative to IRC but cannot be found even using Signal. But "their own needs" are completely out of bounds for you, and it seems pretty clear that this isn't something that's going to be fixed in patches and code, so expecting them to come and fix it because you have an open code base is rather disingenuous.

If you started by promoting Signal as a generic protocol or backend to other projects, it would get much more traction in the FOSS community, as they are attracted to components on which other things can be built.

You can claim that this is a reason to ignore the criticism. But, you will always be right in dismissing critiques like this as you've set up the environment in a way which limits the kind of constructive collaboration that is the hallmark of FOSS.

You will probably say this is not true and cite existing public contribution to the project. But what I am saying is that the interest and contribution would be orders of magnitude larger if you really ran the project in a traditionally open way. One hallmark of this would be federation. Whether or not this makes sense practically (the gmail metaphor applies obviously), it is something that people want an need to order to feel they have ownership of their work on a messaging platform. You're simply not going to talk your way out of this.

For human and community reasons, the upside to federation is probably a lot higher than you appreciate. I hope you consider it. You have built a nice platform, but for your work to make a lasting impact you need to share it with others.

> We've seen a continuation of invasive, Bush-era policies IRT the NSA under Obama...but now Trump is terrifying?

Uh, yeah. The Bush/Obama surveillance policies have largely been seen as dangerous not because of actual concrete harms that have materialized, but because if continued they raise the prospect of a much worse (because of the increased scope possible with modern tools) version of the kind of political targeting based on surveillance that was done by Nixon (prompting legal limits, notably the original FISA act.) And perhaps even beyond that, to the kind of retaliation for dissent seen in authoritarian regimes.

Trump is seen as the kind of figure that would be more likely than a more conventional candilate of either party to make those theoretical risks into concrete harms.

I'm not buying it.

The house is already on fire, and people are wringing their hands because the new owner might have a can of lighter fluid in his pocket.

Why does your phone number keep changing?