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India is displaying classic signs that foreshadow fascism

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Re: India is displaying classic signs that foreshadow fascism

#21

Post by sfifs »

Most external people forget that India is closer to the model of Europe with a united monetary policy than a US or China or any individual countries it is compared to. Each province is big enough to be a country in itself, has significant power and provincial politics are as diverse as the spectrum of governments across Europe (there's actually an elected communist government in a province). The ruling coalition nationally doesn't enjoy rule in majority of the provinces and indeed has little line sight to it.

Therefore, sitting inside India, it's really funny to see outside columnists trying to paint broad generalizations of Indian politics.

Re: India is displaying classic signs that foreshadow fascism

#22

Post by throwawayIndian »

realrocker wrote: post #18

I am not sure about this. India has never been good at conforming to a particular point of view. Aurangzeb tried it. Indira tried it. I read an article about traffic of a country implying how lawful it is. And just before reading this, I almost got knocked down by a big car jumping a red light while on a bike(In Bangalore too. We call ourselves civilized here). So whenever I get worried, we are falling into absolutis…

Oh man! The Big Lebowski reference is 200% accurate. On a serious note though, it feels almost certain that the Modi Government is going to lead India into another bloodshed, sooner or later. I hope not but that sinking feeling just doesn't go away given his track record.

Re: India is displaying classic signs that foreshadow fascism

#23

Post by owaislone »

flawedluck wrote: post #17

Modi isn't inspired by Nazis, neither is he an anti-Muslim. The author is just making a big deal of small things and quoting things out of context. "Protesting students?- Anti-nationalist". Yeah except the student was protesting against the hanging of a cruel terrorist. "Appeal to social frustration" - makes no sense. India is special in this case in no way. "Craves heroic death" - We do make a big deal when someone…

> The author is just making a big deal of small things and quoting things out of context.

.. and that's exactly what people should do to make sure we don't repeat the mistakes of the past. Ignoring the seemingly small things is what leads to much bigger issues. History has taught us this again and again.

It's not a pointless rant but a careful warning of what can happen. Let me guess. Whatever dangers the author exposes here are not applicable directly to you. You feel safe and that is why you don't see what is wrong with India today.

For supporters of BJP, the best thing to do is to make sure India doesn't turn to Fascism by keeping the government they elected in check instead of blindly defending it at every corner. Only way to prove the author wrong.

P.S. I don't think those are small things for a democracy like India.

Re: India is displaying classic signs that foreshadow fascism

#24

Post by throwawayIndian »

sfifs wrote: post #21

Most external people forget that India is closer to the model of Europe with a united monetary policy than a US or China or any individual countries it is compared to. Each province is big enough to be a country in itself, has significant power and provincial politics are as diverse as the spectrum of governments across Europe (there's actually an elected communist government in a province). The ruling coalition nati…

> it's really funny to see outside columnists trying to paint broad generalizations of Indian politics.

It is anything but funny. In ways similar to the rhetoric "Should everyone else go to Pakistan?".

Re: India is displaying classic signs that foreshadow fascism

#25

Post by Shivetya »

Latty wrote: post #16
amriksohata wrote: post #7

What a load of bollocks this is exactly why the right has triumphed in America and Europe, the dumbass left continue their pursuit of identity politics which will wipe them out.

I've seen this a lot recently. 'identity politics' is an odd thing to accuse the left of. While the right continually fights to disadvantage groups of people (or keep them disadvantaged), they claim the left is focusing too much on those groups when they fight back. I'm sure that if they had not been trying to hard to paint slaves not as people, but as chattel, the slave owners in the past would have called abolition…

you really need to study up on it. It is not about trying to disadvantage groups, it is all about using the identity of a group to defend any actions or positions they take. Worse is when it is applied to candidates for office because every disagreement with that candidate is taken instead as an attack on them because of their race, religion, sex, and orientation.

It is a shameless exploitation that the left has championed for many decades. Pitting one group against another and laying the bigot/racist card on anyone who suggest special rights for a particular class/identity are not warranted.

Re: India is displaying classic signs that foreshadow fascism

#26

Post by flawedluck »

pksadiq wrote: post #19
flawedluck wrote: post #17

Modi isn't inspired by Nazis, neither is he an anti-Muslim. The author is just making a big deal of small things and quoting things out of context. "Protesting students?- Anti-nationalist". Yeah except the student was protesting against the hanging of a cruel terrorist. "Appeal to social frustration" - makes no sense. India is special in this case in no way. "Craves heroic death" - We do make a big deal when someone…

> neither is he an anti-Muslim. [citation needed] (considering his involvement in Gujrat riots and Babari Masjid issues.).

How about we stop tagging people with such derogatory terms unless they do something that proves it? He not explicitly said or done anything anti-Muslim, especially not after since he became the Prime Minister.

He has said that Islam had ‘many good aspects’ but, ‘when one community says that my community is different from yours, it is higher than yours, and that until you take refuge in mine you cannot get Moksha [salvation], you cannot get Allah, you cannot get Jesus – then conflict starts’. Hinduism taught "truth is one in different ways", and there would be no conflict if it was accepted that ‘all religions are the same’.

Re: India is displaying classic signs that foreshadow fascism

#27

Post by throwawayIndian »

flawedluck wrote: post #17

Modi isn't inspired by Nazis, neither is he an anti-Muslim. The author is just making a big deal of small things and quoting things out of context. "Protesting students?- Anti-nationalist". Yeah except the student was protesting against the hanging of a cruel terrorist. "Appeal to social frustration" - makes no sense. India is special in this case in no way. "Craves heroic death" - We do make a big deal when someone…

It is a fact that Modi encouraged killing of Muslim families to catapult himself at centerstage politics. One of his cabinet ministers is even a convicted murderer!, of his own colleague in office: research on home minister Haren Pandya.

Re: India is displaying classic signs that foreshadow fascism

#28

Post by Zpalmtree »

Why is there such a circle jerk around fascism? Some people are commies, some people are fascists, what's the big deal?

Just because you support fascism doesn't mean you want to genocide people. Yes, it's happened in the past, but so has it happened with democracy, communism, and any other political ideology you can think of.

Fascism in some places has been very effective, for example Park Chung-hee. You might disagree with some of the things he did, but he made South Korea very prosperous.

Re: India is displaying classic signs that foreshadow fascism

#29

Post by 6502nerdface »

snrplfth wrote: post #6

“These features cannot be organised into a system; many of them contradict each other and are also typical of other kinds of despotism or fanaticism. But it is enough that one of them be present to allow fascism to coagulate around it.” Umberto Eco is a smart guy but that essay is pretty silly. Fascism: anywhere, everywhere, and you can tell it's coming by any number of contradictory and non-definite phenomena.

No, if you read Eco's essay he takes pains to clarify that he's not saying "you can see it coming" -- he's describing the seeds of fascism that are present in many, perhaps all societies, which fascism can potentially latch onto and grow from... the aspects of our socieites that are usually checked, but have the potential to germinate into something worse.

Re: India is displaying classic signs that foreshadow fascism

#30

Post by realrocker »

throwawayIndian wrote: post #22
realrocker wrote: post #18

I am not sure about this. India has never been good at conforming to a particular point of view. Aurangzeb tried it. Indira tried it. I read an article about traffic of a country implying how lawful it is. And just before reading this, I almost got knocked down by a big car jumping a red light while on a bike(In Bangalore too. We call ourselves civilized here). So whenever I get worried, we are falling into absolutis…

Oh man! The Big Lebowski reference is 200% accurate. On a serious note though, it feels almost certain that the Modi Government is going to lead India into another bloodshed, sooner or later. I hope not but that sinking feeling just doesn't go away given his track record.

It's already happened with the lynchings, killings and sporadic riots, but at scale of India, it just doesn't leave a big enough mark. It's kind of sad really. India rationalizes the most horrific acts of humanity, shrugs and moves on.
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