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How Cassini Will Begin Its Date with Death on Saturn

nytimes.com

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Re: How Cassini Will Begin Its Date with Death on Saturn

#21

Post by cgriswald »

Figs wrote: post #11
kkylin wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article didn't say, but off-hand I would guess it's for the same reason they crashed Galileo into Jupiter ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galileo_(spacecraft) ), namely to avoid any possibility of contaminating one of the moons (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_on_Titan ) with life (e.g., bacteria) from Earth.

That seems like a really poor reason for doing it seeing as Cassini carried Huygens with it -- which already landed on Titan over 10 years ago.

Flying a mission to intentionally study a moon is a bit different than accidentally contaminating it while getting no useful data. Titan isn't a likely candidate for contamination anyway and if we ever do find life there it is likely to be distinguishable from Earth life. Enceladus, on the other hand, is one of the likeliest places for Earth-like life in our solar system and much more succeptible to contamination.

Since the orbiter is out of fuel and will eventually crash into something, Saturn makes the most sense.

Re: How Cassini Will Begin Its Date with Death on Saturn

#22

Post by icebraining »

iampherocity wrote: post #20
kkylin wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article didn't say, but off-hand I would guess it's for the same reason they crashed Galileo into Jupiter ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galileo_(spacecraft) ), namely to avoid any possibility of contaminating one of the moons (see https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life_on_Titan ) with life (e.g., bacteria) from Earth.

I don't understand why we're doing this. They will eventually be contaminated in the next 500 years and that's not long evolutionarily speaking. As tech becomes cheaper and the third world starts breaking into the "modern era", we'll have more failed satellites embedded in the sides of every moon in the solar system. And NASA legitimately struggles to make these devoid of life. An exuberant little nation punching a l…

That still means we have 500 years to find legitimate non-terrestrial life.

Re: How Cassini Will Begin Its Date with Death on Saturn

#23

Post by Sharlin »

therein wrote: post #7
rietta wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This looks like the principle "States shall avoid harmful contamination of space and celestial bodies." Presumably crashing into a gas giant is considered less harmful than polluting orbit. Source: http://www.unoosa.org/oosa/en/ourwork/spacelaw/treaties/intr...

How is having a vehicle that is hibernating and can be contacted with considered polluting the orbit? It's not like it is debris. I would see this as in fact the opposite, I would see it as the first step to colonization. Having autonomous outposts all around the solar system, orbiting various celestial bodies. Build a meshnet with them.

It's not like its orbit is stable in an environment like that. Eventually it's going to collide with something due to lack of fuel for maneuvering burns.

Re: How Cassini Will Begin Its Date with Death on Saturn

#26

Post by pm90 »

icebraining wrote: post #22
iampherocity wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't understand why we're doing this. They will eventually be contaminated in the next 500 years and that's not long evolutionarily speaking. As tech becomes cheaper and the third world starts breaking into the "modern era", we'll have more failed satellites embedded in the sides of every moon in the solar system. And NASA legitimately struggles to make these devoid of life. An exuberant little nation punching a l…

That still means we have 500 years to find legitimate non-terrestrial life.

Exactly. Also, In 500 years, it may be possible/economical to sterilize large bodies before sending them to outer space.

I think its a good idea that NASA (and other space agencies) are so careful about this. I wouldn't want any life (or the traces of past life) to be wiped out by organisms from earth.

Re: How Cassini Will Begin Its Date with Death on Saturn

#27

Post by myowncrapulence »

noelwelsh wrote: post #13
myowncrapulence wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are we not actively trying to terraform Mars? Why is "life contamination" seen as a problem for our solar system rather than a goal?

The days of colonialism, when Europeans showed up on foreign shores, killed the natives, and claimed the land as their own, are over.

  are over
You mean like in Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, and Israel?

Re: How Cassini Will Begin Its Date with Death on Saturn

#28

Post by myowncrapulence »

raverbashing wrote: post #17
myowncrapulence wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are we not actively trying to terraform Mars? Why is "life contamination" seen as a problem for our solar system rather than a goal?

> Are we not actively trying to terraform Mars? No > Why is "life contamination" seen as a problem for our solar system rather than a goal? Because you'll not be sure if eventual life that you found there comes from Earth equipment or was there in the first place

So, why is it a goal to send humans there? Humans breathe out bacteria constantly and will guarantee contamination of Mars.

Re: How Cassini Will Begin Its Date with Death on Saturn

#29

Post by noelwelsh »

myowncrapulence wrote: post #27
noelwelsh wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The days of colonialism, when Europeans showed up on foreign shores, killed the natives, and claimed the land as their own, are over.

are over You mean like in Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, and Israel?

Those are proxy wars and/or puppet governments, which is a different thing to colonisation. There is somewhat more regard for the rights of the native inhabitants than in the past.

If we ever find alien life, the Outer Space Treaty prohibits colonisation in the sense we're using here. Of course this is a very easy treaty to sign up to at this point in our development of space travel. If space travel ever becomes cheap enough to enable exploitation of resource on distant planets I imagine those laws will see some amendments.

Re: How Cassini Will Begin Its Date with Death on Saturn

#30

Post by myowncrapulence »

noelwelsh wrote: post #29
myowncrapulence wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

are over You mean like in Iraq, Afghanistan, Syria, and Israel?

Those are proxy wars and/or puppet governments, which is a different thing to colonisation. There is somewhat more regard for the rights of the native inhabitants than in the past. If we ever find alien life, the Outer Space Treaty prohibits colonisation in the sense we're using here. Of course this is a very easy treaty to sign up to at this point in our development of space travel. If space travel ever becomes chea…

So, why is it a goal to send humans there? Humans breathe out bacteria constantly and will guarantee contamination of Mars.
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