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Thoughts on Flash

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Re: Thoughts on Flash

#151

Post by gbrindisi »

henrikschroder wrote: post #139

Clearly, none of you people commenting here are considering the flash gaming market. Yes, I can see how most video sites can ditch their Flash players once almost everyone has html5-capable browsers, and yes videos is the largest use-case for Flash right now, but games is the second largest, involves a lot more money, and cannot be easily replicated without Flash. Also, the people making games in Flash are usually gr…

Even if the people making games in flash are graphic designers doesn't mean they can't learn something new. After all is their job.

Re: Thoughts on Flash

#153

Post by dcurtis »

pilif wrote: post #64

> For example, although Mac OS X has been shipping for almost 10 years now, Adobe just adopted it fully (Cocoa) two weeks ago when they shipped CS5. right. And the Finder - a piece of Software central to OSX was using Carbon until... when exactly? At most 6 months prior to when CS5 came out. iTunes - a corner stone of the iPhone software world? Still on Carbon. If I hate one thing, it's hypocrisy. Aside of that, nice…

Apple purposefully wrote Finder in clean Carbon as an example to developers, to prove that it was possible to make good cross-platform software. iTunes was also written very carefully -- and very cleanly -- in Carbon to be cross-platform.

Adobe, however, hacked Creative Suite into Carbon with buggy, inefficient code and then took 10 years -- ten years -- to schedule the time to fix it.

Re: Thoughts on Flash

#154

Post by revorad »

patio11 wrote: post #91
revorad wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Patrick, you should totally write a book of quotes from your encounters with users. It will be really insightful and such a good laugh.

Tech folks are cynical enough without my help. Here's all the insight I can muster: non-technical people do not have an accurate mental model of how the computer works. They have a semi-accurate mental model of the steps they take to do routine things on the computer: I click this thing, then I type in this thing, then I click this thing, then the magic happens. Deviations from that routine will almost certainly caus…

I thought it would help reduce the cynicism and help programmers make a better mental model of their users (because that's what we've got all wrong at the moment).

Re: Thoughts on Flash

#155

Post by efsavage »

Flash is closed, Apple is open. Huh?

I can build a flash app entirely for free, legally, with zero restrictions, forever, on the tools I used to write it, or where I can deploy it to. Adobe has bent over backwards to make players (also free) backwards compatible. That's pretty open.

I must pay to build an iphone app, which I can only do on a computer owned by the same company, running an OS owned by the same company. This app only runs on hardware made by said company, and only run on an OS by said company. I am restricted in how I can build this, and must live by the whims of an opaque editorial process. In terms of openness, this makes Bill Gates look like RMS.

Re: Thoughts on Flash

#156

Post by dcurtis »

joshwa wrote: post #74

If they're going to pitch HTML5 as an alternative to Flash (and, implicitly, the iPhoneOS API), then why not let them compete directly with Cocoa Touch apps? Why not offer HTML5 developers a way to take advantage of the App Store's monetization and discoverability? Apple already provides some amazing documentation and tutorials for making offline-capable mobile web apps, but they're still treated by Apple as the bast…

Don't you remember that Apple was first trying to force everything on the iPhone to be done on the web?

Re: Thoughts on Flash

#157

Post by endlessvoid94 »

joubert wrote: post #116
joshwa wrote: post #74

If they're going to pitch HTML5 as an alternative to Flash (and, implicitly, the iPhoneOS API), then why not let them compete directly with Cocoa Touch apps? Why not offer HTML5 developers a way to take advantage of the App Store's monetization and discoverability? Apple already provides some amazing documentation and tutorials for making offline-capable mobile web apps, but they're still treated by Apple as the bast…

Can't you create a barebones cocoa touch app that basically just shows safari, and your app runs inside that as ja and HTML?

What's the point? Just point users to your URL instead.

Re: Thoughts on Flash

#158

Post by mbreese »

cninja wrote: post #136
Qz wrote: post #72

This is where he loses me: "Though the operating system for the iPhone, iPod and iPad is proprietary, we strongly believe that all standards pertaining to the web should be open." Adobe can just as easily say: "Though Flash products are proprietary, we strongly believe that standards pertaining to what software is allowed to run on your computer should be open." It's doublespeak either way, and it's crazy to think th…

My head started to spin when trying to reconcile points 1 and 5. Point 1 states Adobe Flash has proprietary features and the standardized open feature sets of HTML5, CSS, and JS should be used instead. Point 5 states 3rd party layers limits development to the standardized features and leaves out the proprietary features that makes Apple unique.

They are talking about two different scenarios that aren't really that related.

Point 1 is in reference to the lack of Flash within Safari.

Point 5 is in reference to banning applications originally written in Flash.

Re: Thoughts on Flash

#159

Post by acg »

joubert wrote: post #149
acg wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Adobe claims that we are a closed system, and that Flash is open, but in fact the opposite is true. Let me explain. I think he states the major reason, Adobe seeks to characterise Apple as against the freedom of the developer. This campaign adds weight to developers that are jilted by the iStore. They can find a home in Adobe. I think that this should clear up why Flash would not be the friend of the iPhone developer…

What is the iStore?

Sorry: the iTunes Store.

Re: Thoughts on Flash

#160

Post by jcromartie »

betageek wrote: post #147
joubert wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can't you create a barebones cocoa touch app that basically just shows safari, and your app runs inside that as ja and HTML?

You could, but Apple are rejecting apps that are just web views or RSS readers so I wouldn't recommend it.

There are plenty of apps that utilize web views inside of native iPhone UIs, like tab bar controllers and other widgets. They are "hybrid" apps and make the best of both and they get by the review process just fine. A lot of them are fairly big names, like Reddit.
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