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I don’t belong in tech

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Re: I don’t belong in tech

#31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Perhaps they would be happier as a designer, where they can make everything fit into perfectly neat boxes. Typically I'd just downvote, but was that condescending comment really needed? This is the sort of toxicity that turns people away from our community.

It is a fair comment. In design you at least have a chance at clean work safe from messy reality.

It's a condescending comment because there are many designers who have to design for the real world. It's no less condescending than saying someone should go into programming where they just have to type out code all day and not face the real world.

Re: I don’t belong in tech

#32
This was great, and well written. As the phenomenon of software and technology expands to encompass all of human activity (and thus all humans), it's also going to bring in diverse mindsets, experiences and approaches.

This is a good thing.

When I was young, tech really only existed in the hearts and minds of a very small, self-selected, few. Most of us had similar or common viewpoints and experiences. It was very easy to go someplace new, find the local group of nerds, exchange a few Star Trek quotes to prove your bona fides, and you'd be in.

But we, and the technology that came from us, was limited to what we could produce given the limited set of experiences and modes of thinking we brought to the table. But we also couldn't see this limitation, because our work was a reflection of all that we could think.

What's happened in the intervening decades is that our technology, the kind that we literally grew up imagineering, while important, has become a minority of what humanity needs technology to do for it.

Even today, the fact that somebody from a non-tech background can go take classes to learn to code, and make a successful business, or have a successful career with that knowledge feels vaguely alien to those of us from the early years.

I've come to the conclusion that the notions I had as a child about what technology was and how it was in my blood, were incredibly wrong. The world of technology is immense - bigger than just software, or hardware. Writing is technology, cheese is technology, sewing is technology... As this enlightenment continues to unroll in my mind, I'm not even sure I know how to latch a definition onto the word that doesn't ring hollow, but it seems vaguely associated with anything that uses our minds to make the human condition better.

The author above, she does belong in technology, it's our insistence on trying to limit the meaning of tech to the kind of tiny world I grew up in, that has convinced her that she doesn't belong. Yes, she doesn't belong in that microcosm of early tech. She belongs in the macrocosm of human betterment.

Re: I don’t belong in tech

#33
post #23

The author makes some great points that I initially wanted to dismiss, but I think are actually really interesting. Unlike many other types of engineering/craft, most experienced software developers have settled on an aversion to perfectionism. A good carpenter wants to build a solid house even if no one will ever see its frame. Ditto to an auto engineer at BMW, or a hardware engineer at Apple, or a mechanical engine…

It's not so much that software is "cheap" (it's not, software is notoriously expensive) but that it's incrementally improvable. If I build a house with a bad frame, it's really hard to make it better over time. If I build a quick MVP, I can easily incrementally improve it.

Today's "quick MVP we can incrementally improve" is tomorrow's "unmaintainable legacy codebase."

But sure, it'll be different this time.

Re: I don’t belong in tech

#34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Perhaps they would be happier as a designer, where they can make everything fit into perfectly neat boxes. Typically I'd just downvote, but was that condescending comment really needed? This is the sort of toxicity that turns people away from our community.

It is a fair comment. In design you at least have a chance at clean work safe from messy reality.

I'm not sure about that - designers have to build a UX that works in the real world, and sometimes there are really complicated processes that need to be exposed in a nice way. I imagine this has similar tradeoffs as programming (i.e. difficulty in implementation, balancing power/intuitiveness)

Re: I don’t belong in tech

#35
Not sure why it had to be prefaced with "white man" talk. Majority (all?) people in software development, who are doing it because they like it, hate to do half-ass job. Yes, even some silly-simple web widget most (all?) want to be perfect. So this has nothing to do with "feelings", being a woman or being non-white.

Trying to deliver perfect product is good in vacuum, but not so in real world. For real world perfect product is not the same as perfect product in vacuum. It takes time to truly understand, but OP, just like all other devs, will get it eventually.

Re: I don’t belong in tech

#36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not so much that software is "cheap" (it's not, software is notoriously expensive) but that it's incrementally improvable. If I build a house with a bad frame, it's really hard to make it better over time. If I build a quick MVP, I can easily incrementally improve it.

Today's "quick MVP we can incrementally improve" is tomorrow's "unmaintainable legacy codebase." But sure, it'll be different this time.

Legacy codebases make money. The engineer anxiety about them is myopic and ignorant of business realities.

If you can code something quickly and well enough that it doesn't immediately collapse under its own weight, you have succeeded. The fact that a codebase has existed long enough to become "legacy" means it did a good enough job to stay alive.

Re: I don’t belong in tech

#37
Most people that complain about shipping the imperfect solution are not aware how inefficient is striving for perfection in the software world. Personally, I have never seen rumination on every nook-and-corner of the product yielding something fruitful. In fact, it invariably results in the opposite — solving the wrong problems and then, solving the real problems that you never thought would've existed. Rinse. Repeat.

The author equates imperfection to sloppiness but I'd argue that the case is quite the opposite. I recall a comment made by Paul Buchheit on Hacker News about FriendFeed —

"Another interesting detail is that this is roughly the 4th iteration on the FriendFeed backend since we launched 17 months ago. If you look at the the graphs at the bottom of Bret's post, you can see that our previous system was about to die -- average pageview latency had increased from about 135ms to 260ms in less than a month! (not a good trend) This new design also accommodates some important upcoming features that would have been problematic in the old system.

This experience reinforces my belief that it's better to be quick than brilliant. If we had wasted a lot of time trying to build some really smart, super-scalable system right from the start, it would have inevitably been over-optimized for the wrong things, since the product and requirements have changed quite a bit since launch."

Re: I don’t belong in tech

#38
post #23

The author makes some great points that I initially wanted to dismiss, but I think are actually really interesting. Unlike many other types of engineering/craft, most experienced software developers have settled on an aversion to perfectionism. A good carpenter wants to build a solid house even if no one will ever see its frame. Ditto to an auto engineer at BMW, or a hardware engineer at Apple, or a mechanical engine…

I'll have to disagree. I used to be a carpenter and the objective is definitely not to be perfect. Building anything, houses or apps, the objective is to work within tolerances. The modern system of 2x4 framing and drywall allows those tolerances to be very loose without affecting the end product, but I digress. Would you prefer a half-finished house with perfectly cut studs (that you can't see inside the drywall), or a completed house that has looser tolerances but has passed inspection?

Even in those fields that people imagine involve a lot of perfection, like watercolors or fine Japanese carpentry, the perfection is not arrived at by agonizing over details and overworking the piece. The perfection comes from the muscle memory of someone who has done it many times. App development should be the same way.

This economy of effort is intrinsic to any craft and is part of being a good craftsperson. I used to have an attitude similar to the author, a mixture of derision and envy towards those who were able to ship. She needs to learn that if she does not abandon this counterproductive mental handicap, she will never be a good craftsperson, in software or anything else.

Re: I don’t belong in tech

#39
post #23

The author makes some great points that I initially wanted to dismiss, but I think are actually really interesting. Unlike many other types of engineering/craft, most experienced software developers have settled on an aversion to perfectionism. A good carpenter wants to build a solid house even if no one will ever see its frame. Ditto to an auto engineer at BMW, or a hardware engineer at Apple, or a mechanical engine…

I'd rather give a completely different explanation.

Building 90% of a software is easy, getting to 100% is insanely difficult.

Building 90% of a construction/hardware/car/... is hard, the final bits are easy.

Re: I don’t belong in tech

#40
post #17

"I am not comfortable making half-ass s..." Agile and Lean both contained good ideas, but they've been misinterpreted. "Flexible processes" became "no processes", "rigorously test your assumptions" became "try things at random". Web and mobile are becoming mature platforms. There's now a long history of web and mobile products to study - the design, engineering and business principles for success in these products sh…

> I'm a white male - a right-wing white male - and I agree with her. Why do you need to include that? She very deliberately said that this is not an article about race, gender, or politics.

The article author spends numerous paragraphs establishing her identify to the reader as a womain in tech before explaining that this isn't the issue she has with tech. The comment author has merely done the same?
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