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Dear Millenials: Your Parents Lied to You

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Re: Dear Millenials: Your Parents Lied to You

#21

Post by oldgregg »

simon_ wrote: post #6
mattmiller wrote: post #5

I think a related problem is that college professors are usually soft. I have been in a number of classes where a group of students take control and demand a curve, or an extension of a project, and in their defense, why not? Many if not most professors will cave. The best classes were usually taught by strict professors with the confidence to stick up for their original lesson plan.

I think a related problem is that he is interacting with "PR majors".

You're ignoring the fact that almost all Americans ARE "PR majors" -- lots of other names for shitty degrees, of course -- but the hard sciences are dominated by indians and asians.

Communications, sports medicine, all these majors attract a disproportionate amount of slackers BECAUSE they are easy. The only reason the hard sciences are not AS BAD is because the subject matter makes it much harder to dumb down.

Re: Dear Millenials: Your Parents Lied to You

#22

Post by sophacles »

brc wrote: post #18
trjordan wrote: post #10

Somewhat tangentially, I had very few writing teachers/profs that forced me to write better. The ones that did were not the hard-asses willing to bruise my ego and fill the page with red ink; they were the ones who could destroy my thesis and render my examples impotent with 3 comments at the end of the paper. Invariably, if I got a teacher/prof who bled all over my creations, I'd start with B-s at the beginning and…

I'm going to have to go ahead and disagree with you. The ego needs to be bruised in order to deflate the head of the youngster so learning can begin. I too had my ego bruised and spirits crushed by hard-marking, discipline demanding examiners. In each case, they're the only the ones I remember. All the wishy-washy as-long-as-you-tried ones are as forgotten as they were useless to my learning. Half the battle in teach…

If only I had known 10 years ago what I would claim ignorance of today...

Re: Dear Millenials: Your Parents Lied to You

#23

Post by trjordan »

brc wrote: post #18
trjordan wrote: post #10

Somewhat tangentially, I had very few writing teachers/profs that forced me to write better. The ones that did were not the hard-asses willing to bruise my ego and fill the page with red ink; they were the ones who could destroy my thesis and render my examples impotent with 3 comments at the end of the paper. Invariably, if I got a teacher/prof who bled all over my creations, I'd start with B-s at the beginning and…

I'm going to have to go ahead and disagree with you. The ego needs to be bruised in order to deflate the head of the youngster so learning can begin. I too had my ego bruised and spirits crushed by hard-marking, discipline demanding examiners. In each case, they're the only the ones I remember. All the wishy-washy as-long-as-you-tried ones are as forgotten as they were useless to my learning. Half the battle in teach…

I suppose I should have been more clear. There's a difference between drowning a paper in red ink and words like "trainwreck" and actually showing error. More bluntly, yelling at a student for being stupid and showing a student where they made their errors are entirely different, and I would argue that the second is much more effective.

To my point above, the vindictive teachers were not necessarily the most insightful, and they were not the ones who deflated my ego. The comments that hurt were the terse ones that showed both that they clearly understood what I was trying to say, and that I was wrong. Pointing out a logical inconsistency in my argument in a polite way is a much less abrasive and much more effective way of teaching.

Perhaps I should say that a students ego often gets in the way of producing increasingly better work, but being a dick to them isn't always the answer.

Re: Dear Millenials: Your Parents Lied to You

#24

Post by vsync »

oldgregg wrote: post #21
simon_ wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think a related problem is that he is interacting with "PR majors".

You're ignoring the fact that almost all Americans ARE "PR majors" -- lots of other names for shitty degrees, of course -- but the hard sciences are dominated by indians and asians. Communications, sports medicine, all these majors attract a disproportionate amount of slackers BECAUSE they are easy. The only reason the hard sciences are not AS BAD is because the subject matter makes it much harder to dumb down.

> You're ignoring the fact that almost all Americans ARE "PR majors" -- lots of other names for shitty degrees, of course -- but the hard sciences are dominated by indians and asians.

sod off, racist

Re: Dear Millenials: Your Parents Lied to You

#25

Post by drinian »

These editorials always make me wonder if my friends, cousins, and I are some sort of statistical outlier in my generation, or whether, maybe, it's just that the good workers my age don't get comment.

Then again, I've been told I'm too critical quite a bit.

Re: Dear Millenials: Your Parents Lied to You

#26

Post by lotharbot »

sophacles wrote: post #16
Dove wrote: post #4

Millenials, those born between '78 and '95 That's shifted a good five or ten years back from what I thought. I was born in '82; my parents are Boomers. I thought that made me Generation X. I. . . I don't want to be a Millenial.

I was born in 80, and consider myself on the cusp. I identify w/ X in some ways and Millenials in others. It was actually highly amusing in college, there was a noticable shift between the oldest of my peers and the youngest of my peers, which when I described it to some of the older ones said they didn't notice between a similar variance of their peers. Obviously such things are fuzzy, but that is the general feelin…

I think for those born in the 1980-1982 range, which generation they fall into depends very much on their personal experiences.

I was born in 1980, but I had 2 older brothers and I was heavily involved in their social circles. MacGyver and the A-Team were the stuff of my generation. I always felt like my younger sisters were weird; Power Rangers was a show of their generation. I would consider myself at the tail end of Gen X.

My wife was born in 1982, watched Power Rangers, and doesn't remember the fall of the Soviet Union... but also grew up using UNIX, remembers Vinyl, owned a Walkman as a teen, and feels most socially comfortable with people in the 35-50 age bracket (who often assume she's in her late 30s.) I'd say she's more Gen X than Millennial.

Another close friend of mine was born in 1981, and I'd consider him 100% Millennial.

Re: Dear Millenials: Your Parents Lied to You

#27

Post by brc »

trjordan wrote: post #23
brc wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm going to have to go ahead and disagree with you. The ego needs to be bruised in order to deflate the head of the youngster so learning can begin. I too had my ego bruised and spirits crushed by hard-marking, discipline demanding examiners. In each case, they're the only the ones I remember. All the wishy-washy as-long-as-you-tried ones are as forgotten as they were useless to my learning. Half the battle in teach…

I suppose I should have been more clear. There's a difference between drowning a paper in red ink and words like "trainwreck" and actually showing error. More bluntly, yelling at a student for being stupid and showing a student where they made their errors are entirely different, and I would argue that the second is much more effective. To my point above, the vindictive teachers were not necessarily the most insightf…

>Perhaps I should say that a students ego often gets in the way of producing increasingly better work, but being a dick to them isn't always the answer.

And I would agree with you there. As long as the point is driven home that the work is below par, and the reasons why, without any fancy wrapping or ego-massaging. Being direct without being a dick, though there are plenty of people who don't know how to do one without being the other.

I'm still appreciative to a Grade 8 maths teacher who humiliated me in front of the class for slacking off during the semester and letting grades slip. Because I sure worked hard to prove him wrong next time. I don't know if there would have been any other way to get through to me at that time.

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