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Add-ons in 2017

blog.mozilla.org

51–60 of 121 posts

Re: Add-ons in 2017

#52
post #43
post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a Firefox developer, whenever I make a change (and I mean pretty much any change to an API accessible through platform JS), I have two choices: 1/ either try and locate all the add-ons that will be broken, get in touch with their developers, be ignored by most of them, start several weeks of negotiation with those who do answer, then eventually, several months after my code is ready, land the change, and notice th…

Is there a reason a both approach wasn't pursued with the current method being marked unsafe but still available for use? A la Rust mixing code but having to explicitly mark unsafe bits. For reasons listed in other comments above, the "we will expand WebExtensions API coverage based on current add-on needs" scares the shit out of me. I'm having visions of why I quit using Chrome because there was some download UX tha…

I'm pretty sure that there is some such mechanism. At least, I've seen patches related to such a mechanism. I don't remember the specifics and I can't find the documentation right now, but I seem to remember that there was something called the "WebExtensions Extension API" or something such that let developers access existing unstable APIs. It's probably somewhere.

Note that in this case, we're not discussing (only) "unsafe" APIs but also "unstable" APIs that can change from one day to the next without warning.

Re: Add-ons in 2017

#53
post #26
post #2

I'd love some figures on whether the main popular extensions will continue working, as well as how many in the Firefox Add-ons site are already web extensions. I'm curious about my mains: - Classic theme restorer - uBlock - DownThemAll - Markdown Here As I'm already using electrolysis, I know Markdown Here basically doesn't work. How I can check whether things will break or not.

You can consult https://www.arewee10syet.com/ ; seems authors are mostly showing some efforts to migrate their extensions. CTR: seems OK, uBlock: uBockO: seems OK, DTA: bug, but at least tries to be e10s compatible, Mardown here: unknown (supposedly not compatible?) You can try yourself: either install https://nightly.mozilla.org/ and load it with your addons (it uses different profile) or use your stable one and loo…

Total Mozilla noob here: Tab Mix Plus shows up as compatible. Does that mean that I will be able to use it with the new extension system?

Re: Add-ons in 2017

#54

Old or complex add-ons are what keep me with firefox. Will switch to qutebrowser¹ and probably chrome as my backup for what the cutie can't handle. ¹keyboard goodness: https://github.com/The-Compiler/qutebrowser

Thanks for that pointer! I've been off Firefox for the past six months since they broke my private feedreader extension[1]. I'd been using Opera but I'm typing this out on qutebrowser.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11287049

Re: Add-ons in 2017

#55
post #50
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The native messaging API is not useful for addon developers . They only cater to application developers that ship a companion addon to their application. js-ctypes allowed an addon to access already-present native libs on the the host machine or bundled with the addon itself. Messaging only works if you can get users to install some external application in addition to your addon, which is a too-tall hurdle for small…

> js-ctypes allowed an addon to access already-present native libs on the the host machine or bundled with the addon itself. Messaging only works if you can get users to install some external application in addition to your addon, which is a too-tall hurdle for small extensions. > > From my perspective those barely comparable. I haven't checked, but I seem to remember that you can provide a platform-specific binary a…

> On the other hand, this is the kind of paradigm shift that was implemented by operating systems ~20 years ago

What? No. Every OS out there allows the loading of user (administrator) supplied code to increase it's functionality.

In other words, every OS out there allows extensions that touch their internal APIs (or a very permissive subset of them in the case of Windows, that is known by how restrictive this is).

Re: Add-ons in 2017

#56
post #50
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The native messaging API is not useful for addon developers . They only cater to application developers that ship a companion addon to their application. js-ctypes allowed an addon to access already-present native libs on the the host machine or bundled with the addon itself. Messaging only works if you can get users to install some external application in addition to your addon, which is a too-tall hurdle for small…

> js-ctypes allowed an addon to access already-present native libs on the the host machine or bundled with the addon itself. Messaging only works if you can get users to install some external application in addition to your addon, which is a too-tall hurdle for small extensions. > > From my perspective those barely comparable. I haven't checked, but I seem to remember that you can provide a platform-specific binary a…

> On the other hand, this is the kind of paradigm shift that was implemented by operating systems ~20 years ago

No. Kernel modules can be installed at runtime. The user just has to grant the application the necessary privileges.

This means OS developers do not try to attempt to "strike a balance" between power and safety. They allow both, the unsafe stuff merely requires a fairly simple opt-in.

This is the whole crux of the issue. I do not mind security measures, as long as there is a bypass. Mozilla has taken the - in my opinion extremist - position that even bypasses cannot be allowed because they know what's best for users.

> I haven't checked, but I seem to remember that you can provide a platform-specific binary as part of an add-on, spawn it from WebExtensions and then communicate with it through the native bridge.

I am not aware of any such feature. This used to be true for bootstrapped extensions, but not for webextensions.

> I haven't checked myself, but I believe that this mechanism has been published, as an extension called "the WebExtension Extension" or something like that.

yes, only works on dev edition though.

Re: Add-ons in 2017

#57
post #49
post #45

Slightly OT: There is another problem that most people seems to miss. Add-ons in their current form in ff are tightly coupled to the browser to the point that it's the browser itself. In the modern web, the browser knows too much about you, and so does the add-on, and it's not unheard of them to explore it[1] How does that free webpage to PDF converter add-on make money? By selling your web history of course. [1] htt…

Web history is also available to WebExtensions, so I don't see how this is relevant to people missing XUL/SDK addons?

Added OT tag, I was not comparing webextensions, pointing out, this is still an unsolved problem.

Re: Add-ons in 2017

#58
There may be a lot of components and interests involved in this change.

As a user of, not developer for, Firefox with its extensions, it's this simple for me: The day my existing extensions stop working -- the day neither they nor an alternative under the new paradigm offer equivalent functionality -- is the day I no longer have any reason to stay with Firefox.

I'm not saying, "Stop, wait, a user is unhappy!"

I'm simply saying that, as a perhaps sophisticated user with some more advanced functionality, security, and privacy concerns, the set of extensions I currently use is my only compelling reason for using Firefox over Chrome.

Well, that and Google/Chrome's current trend towards its own version of Embrace, Extend, Extinguish wrapped within a panopticon.

I embrace the browser as the user client. I'm glad to have security issues addressed, but I also require that the browser do what I want, and not what -- a la Chrome, for example -- media interests want to dictate.

I'm watching 2017 with trepidation, and wonder whether and when something may fork. Not unrealistically, though; I'm skeptical any fork is going to have the resources and commitment to maintain a modern, full-featured browser in the face of current and future... err, developments.

Maybe such a fork will, both of desire and of necessity, look instead towards a bit of minimalism. Not doing "everything", but doing core functionality well and securely.

I guess then we'd have to see whether the content farms with their Javascript++, DRM delivered content, end up leaving such a fork too much out in the cold for it to maintain sufficient interest and/or usefulness to keep itself going.

Re: Add-ons in 2017

#60

Wondering if/how Zotero and similar applications will exist beyond 2017. Will they need to fork Firefox?

Zotero will work the way it does with Chrome now: there will be a plugin that integrates with Zotero Standalone, which will continue to be developed using XULRunner.

I think this will be good in the long run--Zotero is complex enough to merit being its own application, and separating Zotero and browser plugins will make it easier to migrate Zotero off XULRunner at some point, if the developers choose to do so.

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