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Israeli firm can steal phone data in seconds

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Re: Israeli firm can steal phone data in seconds

#81

Post by CamperBob2 »

na85 wrote: post #66
wahsd wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You highlight a kind of social disconnect among a segment of the population that are kind of eternal liberal optimist loyalists that have no problem trusting their parent, the government with any and all sorts of individual rights. It is precisely why some people simply cannot look through or past the notion that the government could somehow not be a benevolent parent that only has our best interest in mind and are t…

The tone and word choice in this post throws into stark relief the enormity of what you don't understand about left-leaning people.

What I understand is that nobody should fear a state monopoly on violence more than the left.

What I don't understand is why they don't understand that.

Re: Israeli firm can steal phone data in seconds

#82

Post by ikonst »

45h34jh53k4j wrote: post #6

So we have learned that some phone vendors give Cellebrite their phones before they reach market in order for them to discover and exploit vulnerabilities. Apple refuses to do business with these 'forensic' criminals. Do not purchase a phone from a vendor that engages in this unethical practise.

Cellebrite got its start with the UME, a phone memory transfer tool for carriers' (POS and support). Carrier-oriented tools are a major part of its operations, though there have been some talks about spinning this off to a separate company.

Cellebrite gets early access to phones NOT due to its forensics operations, but for UME, since carriers (and that's lots(!) of carriers worldwide) are very much interested in good consumer experience on the devices' launch day.

I actually doubt it's been particularly significant to its forensics operations.

Re: Israeli firm can steal phone data in seconds

#83

Post by ikonst »

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #64
ronreiter wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a profitable company. It doesn't need US money. If your government needs to hack a phone that belongs to a terrorist to protect innocent US citizens then what's the problem? Oh, you're an antisemite. Sorry, missed that.

> Oh, you're an antisemite. Sorry, missed that. What? I'm opposed to using U.S. tax dollars to contravene the security of U.S.-designed, manufactured and used devices and operating systems. I don't care if it's the FBI [1], a Canadian company [2] or the Israelis. It's shitty that you devolve your rhetoric so quickly. This is the most disturbing exchange I've ever had on this forum. > If your government needs to hack…

Does anyone track? I guess as much anyone tracks any "U.S. tax dollars" going to any other US government stuff one doesn't like or agree with. (In other words, probably not much.)

Cellebrite doesn't "target" the U.S. It happily develops forensic tools to target Chinese, U.S.-ian, heck, even Israeli phones (if there were any to speak of).

Furthermore, Cellebrite don't sell exclusively to the U.S. They will sell to Canada, UK, France, Germany or any legit law enforcement agency that has budget. U.S. law enforcement may refrain from buying Cellebrite wares. They might decide to buy from a competitor, like Swedish firm MSAB. Heck, they may decide it's "unethical" to own such tools.

While it might adversely affect Cellebrite's bottom line, I think it will first and foremost adversely affect U.S. police departments' capabilities.

Re: Israeli firm can steal phone data in seconds

#85

Post by andrepd »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #79
Steko wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People don't favor gun control because they're eternal optimists about the government's benevolence, that is a ridiculous straw man. Generally people favor gun control because -- to use the same language -- they are not eternal optimists about the benevolence of their fellow citizens who sometimes murder large groups of innocents.

If they bothered to crack a history book, of course, they'd come to understand that on a long-enough timeline, they're most likely to be shot by their own government, military, or police forces. But of course, That Can't Happen Here, because We're Special. (How many times have you heard that schtick lately?) After that, the person most likely to shoot you is a fellow criminal that you're either associated with or com…

I don't even know where to start.

Do you have any sources on your first claim? Or on your other claims? Also, gun control costs elections that would otherwise be won handily? With so much going on on this last election, do you think the barely discussed topic of gun control was the single most important topic to blame for an election that could otherwise have been won, and won handily? Would you have Hillary be against gun control, offering the majority of people that favour it no major candidate reflecting their beliefs?

Re: Israeli firm can steal phone data in seconds

#86

Post by na85 »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #81
na85 wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The tone and word choice in this post throws into stark relief the enormity of what you don't understand about left-leaning people.

What I understand is that nobody should fear a state monopoly on violence more than the left. What I don't understand is why they don't understand that.

>nobody should fear a state monopoly on violence more than the left

This is your opinion only.

>What I don't understand is why they don't understand that.

Perhaps that's because you don't understand "the left" which is of course no more a monolithic, uniform entity than "the right".

It's almost like politics is full of nuance, and issuing blanket statements like the above just simply doesn't work unless you're talking to people that love platitudes. Like the right.

See what I did there?

Re: Israeli firm can steal phone data in seconds

#87

Post by sjwright »

flipp3r wrote: post #3
turc1656 wrote: post #2

"But privacy and rights activists worry such powerful technology can wind up in the wrong hands, leading to abuses." Am I to believe that this firm is the right hands? Or government? Please...all hands are the wrong hands. These vulnerabilities need to be closed. I wouldn't be surprised if the NSA or some other government tentacle was paying them not to make whatever they found known. Gee, I sound paranoid. What am I…

Actually Cellebrite themselves have been victim of some kind of hack last month and had a load of their internal documents leaked online. So no, if any, this firm is _not_ the right hands.

The only "right hands" for a 0-day exploit is the device manufacturer.

Re: Israeli firm can steal phone data in seconds

#88

Post by sjwright »

ka4eli wrote: post #41

Sounds like an Apple advertisment.

And the good kind of advertising, because it's accurate. Apple did the hard engineering work across their entire software and hardware stack because they knew it was important.

They didn't settle for good enough.

They didn't weasel out of it by blaming "ease of use" concerns.

They didn't argue that maximum security wasn't a high priority for their customers.

They didn't deploy marketing slogans to pretend like they had done the hard engineering work. (cough Knox cough)

Re: Israeli firm can steal phone data in seconds

#89

Post by CamperBob2 »

andrepd wrote: post #85
CamperBob2 wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they bothered to crack a history book, of course, they'd come to understand that on a long-enough timeline, they're most likely to be shot by their own government, military, or police forces. But of course, That Can't Happen Here, because We're Special. (How many times have you heard that schtick lately?) After that, the person most likely to shoot you is a fellow criminal that you're either associated with or com…

I don't even know where to start. Do you have any sources on your first claim? Or on your other claims? Also, gun control costs elections that would otherwise be won handily? With so much going on on this last election, do you think the barely discussed topic of gun control was the single most important topic to blame for an election that could otherwise have been won, and won handily ? Would you have Hillary be agai…

I don't even know where to start.

But you're going to anyway, right?

Do you have any sources on your first claim?

I'm not your personal reference librarian, but you might start with a few of the more reader-friendly popular accounts and see where your interests take you. Solzhenitsyn's The Gulag Archipelago is worthwhile; also Milton Mayer's They Thought They Were Free, and perhaps Ma Bo's Blood Red Sunset. The idea behind recommending these particular books is that they helped me move past the special pleading fallacy that is American exceptionalism ("It can't happen here.")

Hopefully others can point you toward some similar books on the Armenian, Cambodian, Rwandan, and other 20th century genocides, as I'm not as familiar with them.

All told, you'd have to cite about 100,000,000 civilian gun deaths to catch up with the records set by modern governments who weren't as afraid of their citizens as they should have been. It's going to take a lot of Columbines and Sandy Hooks to rack up that kind of score.

Would you have Hillary be against gun control, offering the majority of people that favour it no major candidate reflecting their beliefs?

Yes. It's not as if removing gun control from the Democratic platform would send those voters into the arms of the Republicans.

Re: Israeli firm can steal phone data in seconds

#90

Post by PhantomGremlin »

alimbada wrote: post #74
wang_li wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Backup your phone. Wipe your phone. Cross the border. Restore your phone.

Or don't take your phone. On the other hand they've asked people to login to their email accounts using laptops they've provided.

Same thing for your laptop. Back everything up to the cloud, then load a clean copy of the OS before crossing the border.
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