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Bye Bye Emojis: Emacs Hates MacOS

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Re: Bye Bye Emojis: Emacs Hates MacOS

#41

Post by beedogs »

kitsunesoba wrote: post #29
vilhelm_s wrote: post #7

And several other Mac features were stopped before they made it into the official release. This is Richard Stallman's policy: "GNU Emacs should never offer people a practical reason to use some other system instead of GNU. Therefore, when someone implements a useful new feature but only for a non-GNU system, we do not accept it that form." https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2015-12/msg01... https://lists.…

If the goal is to encourage people to use GNU software and potentially even migrate to a full GNU system, I find this policy counterintuitive. It comes off as needless and antagonistic and it pushes me further away from GNU and towards free software that's not so tangled up in rigid philosophies, or worse, proprietary software.

Then, by all means, go use whatever software you want.

There's a place for ideological purists in software and I for one am glad RMS is around.

Re: Bye Bye Emojis: Emacs Hates MacOS

#42

Post by burke »

Here's the diff:

    -          /* Don't use a color bitmap font unless its family is
    -             explicitly specified.  */
    -          if ((sym_traits & kCTFontTraitColorGlyphs) && NILP (family))
    +          /* Don't use a color bitmap font until it is supported on
    +	     free platforms.  */
    +          if (sym_traits & kCTFontTraitColorGlyphs)
https://github.com/emacs-mirror/emacs/commit/9344612d3cd1643...

Re: Bye Bye Emojis: Emacs Hates MacOS

#43

Post by lilyball »

jordigh wrote: post #27

As one of GNU's flagship products, why shouldn't Emacs remind users that it is not in agreement with Apple's treatment of its users? GNU has an agenda, just like Apple does. Intel cripples icc for non-Intel CPUs, making it emit pessimised assembler. Apple makes sure that its hardware only works with other Apple products and that macOS can only be legally virtualised on Apple hardware. Everyone has an agenda. The diff…

Deliberately crippling your product on Apple platforms does not in any way "remind users that it is not in agreement with Apple's treatment of its users". In fact, it's fairly ironic that, in an attempt to protest someone else's treatment of users, Emacs has decided to treat its users badly. Deliberately crippling Emacs will not make Apple change, and will not get people to switch away from Apple platforms. But what it might do is get people to switch away from Emacs.

Re: Bye Bye Emojis: Emacs Hates MacOS

#44

Post by madeofpalk »

phee wrote: post #36
madeofpalk wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> we suggest to install an appropriate font, such as Symbola It's worth pointing out that this is not the official 'Apple Color Emoji' font, so it will always lag behind Apple's implementation. That, and have completely different (IMHO, ugly) artwork, which can be a real issue http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2016/04/12/473965971/... http://samedaytranslations.com/blog/lost-in-translation-emoj...

Is it really Apple's font? I believe WhatsApp on Android uses the same. I guess everyone identifies them as Apple's because WhatsApp is not popular in US. I find it way uglier than Google's, too much detail makes them unusable at small sizes. Anyway I find emoji worsen the communication. There was a time where I could just use :) when I was smiling and :D when really laughing. Now there's so much different smiling va…

Yes, it is Apple's artwork. While Apple might have licensed it to some third parties, I'm more inclined to believe that they turn a blind eye to others using it 'inappropriately' because it still plays in their favour.

Re: Bye Bye Emojis: Emacs Hates MacOS

#45

Post by jimmies »

gok wrote: post #22

"Therefore, when someone implements a useful new feature but only for a non-GNU system, we do not accept it that form." Users of non-GNU systems that use GNU software: the FSF is actively trying to make your life more difficult.

Just as if you don't agree with Apple, you are welcome to use the alternatives. If you don't agree with GNU, you are welcome to use the alternatives.

Re: Bye Bye Emojis: Emacs Hates MacOS

#46

Post by pasquinelli »

lilyball wrote: post #43
jordigh wrote: post #27

As one of GNU's flagship products, why shouldn't Emacs remind users that it is not in agreement with Apple's treatment of its users? GNU has an agenda, just like Apple does. Intel cripples icc for non-Intel CPUs, making it emit pessimised assembler. Apple makes sure that its hardware only works with other Apple products and that macOS can only be legally virtualised on Apple hardware. Everyone has an agenda. The diff…

Deliberately crippling your product on Apple platforms does not in any way "remind users that it is not in agreement with Apple's treatment of its users". In fact, it's fairly ironic that, in an attempt to protest someone else's treatment of users, Emacs has decided to treat its users badly. Deliberately crippling Emacs will not make Apple change, and will not get people to switch away from Apple platforms. But what…

is removing multicolor font support crippling emacs?

Re: Bye Bye Emojis: Emacs Hates MacOS

#47

Post by vesak »

saidajigumi wrote: post #28
vilhelm_s wrote: post #7

And several other Mac features were stopped before they made it into the official release. This is Richard Stallman's policy: "GNU Emacs should never offer people a practical reason to use some other system instead of GNU. Therefore, when someone implements a useful new feature but only for a non-GNU system, we do not accept it that form." https://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/emacs-devel/2015-12/msg01... https://lists.…

Yes, yes. Hold Emacs hostage Mr. Stallman. That'll make everyone stay up all night hacking to bring your lackluster platform to parity with its competition. There's a real need for innovation and great ideas to better support all manner of open community resources, free software and beyond. But stupid control games are totes better than all that.

>That'll make everyone stay up all night hacking to bring your lackluster platform to parity with its competition.

Do you know any other platform that managed to form a foundation for org-mode? Until there is, emacs may not be called a "lackluster platform".

Re: Bye Bye Emojis: Emacs Hates MacOS

#48

Post by Grue3 »

gok wrote: post #22

"Therefore, when someone implements a useful new feature but only for a non-GNU system, we do not accept it that form." Users of non-GNU systems that use GNU software: the FSF is actively trying to make your life more difficult.

More like, you chose to make your life more difficult by using free software on non-free OS.

Re: Bye Bye Emojis: Emacs Hates MacOS

#50

Post by _ph_ »

It is a strange interpretation of freedom, if you are free to run the software how you want, except if RMS disapproves your OS. I think this way of "defending free software" is rather counterproductive. I say this as a strong supporter of free and open source software and both a Mac and Linux user. I want Linux or any other free operation system to be strong in the market. But this should be reached on features and capabilities, not on limiting software on other operation systems. Fortunately thanks to its open source nature, it should be possible to maintain a branch of Emacs for the Mac which keeps this feature alive. This is where open source is strong.
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