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I had a health crisis in France

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Re: I had a health crisis in France

#31

Post by ekianjo »

antirez wrote: post #21

This is normal on all western Europe states. However France has very high standards in general about health care and is regarded as one of the best systems. I think it's time for US citizens to accept that most of Europe has better life expectancy, lower infant mortality than US, and to be ill is not a financial tragedy. Moreover the treatment that a low-income and high-income citizen receives is very similar, so the…

> Europe has better life expectancy,

Diet has a lot more to to about that than medical care.

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#32

Post by jjnoakes »

merb wrote: post #17
raphaelj wrote: post #6

> My individual burden, however, is far more reasonable than > an American might assume. I pay an annual income tax of > about 23%. How comes this number is that low? Tax revenue in France account for about 48% of the country's GDP[1]. I'm living in Belgium, and my payroll tax is already higher than these 23%. -- [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_reven...

I wondered about that as well, I pay like 40%...

40% on all of your income? Or is it tiered? Where do you live?

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#33

Post by ekianjo »

iraklism wrote: post #30

I still giggle a bit every single time one of these EU healthcare stories pops up. It highlights a core difference between one of the two most "advanced" places in the western world. For us Europeans, we don't even think that free healthcare, free education ( university included ) , and free state support when things go wrong is a right. It is a as essential as a core human function as breathing and blinking. We don'…

> free education ( university included )

La Fac is one of the worst places to get an education though.

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#34

Post by sgt101 »

gambiting wrote: post #12
raphaelj wrote: post #6

> My individual burden, however, is far more reasonable than > an American might assume. I pay an annual income tax of > about 23%. How comes this number is that low? Tax revenue in France account for about 48% of the country's GDP[1]. I'm living in Belgium, and my payroll tax is already higher than these 23%. -- [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_reven...

It's probably tiered, like in many other EU countries. In UK for example you don't pay any tax on the first 10k earned, then 20% on anything between 10k and 40k, and then 40% on anything above 40k. I think there's a tier above it as well, but I'm not 100% sure. I know France has more tiers and they are more aggressive(80% being the highest I think?)

There's a 45% tier and also super tax that kicks in at £100k due to having your £10k allowance removed (so from 100k to 120k you have to pay ~70%)

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#35

Post by Carioca »

raphaelj wrote: post #6

> My individual burden, however, is far more reasonable than > an American might assume. I pay an annual income tax of > about 23%. How comes this number is that low? Tax revenue in France account for about 48% of the country's GDP[1]. I'm living in Belgium, and my payroll tax is already higher than these 23%. -- [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_reven...

Different countries have wildly different tax strategies. Sales tax, property tax, corporate tax are some avenues that may make up the difference here. Belgium in particular IIRC draws a large portion of its tax revenue from income taxes

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#36

Post by Taniwha »

angry-hacker wrote: post #13

Does France really have that low tax rate? Usually it's not only income tax people are paying over here and once Americans laern the total % of your money regular Joe pays for the government they are in shock, since they are not used to having so little money being left on the table.

here in NZ I pay the high 30% marginal rate (that includes social security) and get mostly free health care. Drugs have a low co-pay, we have one organisation bulk buying for the entire country

The difference of course is I'm not paying for a bunch of cowboys who invade other countries at the drop of a hat

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#37

Post by boudin »

angry-hacker wrote: post #13

Does France really have that low tax rate? Usually it's not only income tax people are paying over here and once Americans laern the total % of your money regular Joe pays for the government they are in shock, since they are not used to having so little money being left on the table.

There's several taxes. The tax he talks about is what you pay based on your revenues (with several ties, like in the uk). In france we receive what we call a 'salaire brut' which is a salary on which the employer already payed some taxes (which are quite high if i'm not mistaken). On this 'salaire brut' some taxes are automaticaly taken (including some for healthcare), then you obtain what we call 'salaire net', which the money that you get into your account. On this 'salaire net' you still have to pay income taxes (the next year for the previous for the moment, it my change to be taken immediatly on your salary, like in the uk).

I don't know, altogether how much taxes we pay. It varies depending your salary, your job or location (farmers have a different healthcare for exemple). Including everything, If i remember well, an employee cost twice his salary to the employer. A salaire net is something like 2/3 of the salaire brut. Income taxes depends of your income. In comparison with european countries, I think that it's mainly the employer part of taxes that are high.

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#38

Post by fiftypounds »

I similar, but much less medically severe, experience with a gallbladder infection due to stones. This was in Germany. The cost of the sonogram and and ultrasound was c.a. 100 euro. The blood test was a pittance. And, becuase my medical German was/is very poor I had an exensive private consultation with the director of the E.R. who spoke near-natively fluent English.

The total cost: 250 euro out-of-pocket The cost of one sonogram in the US: $1500 (before insurance)

Healthcare in the US is a byzantine protection racket and very potentially a means to mass surveilance beyond the scope of public health.

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#39

Post by glandium »

raphaelj wrote: post #6

> My individual burden, however, is far more reasonable than > an American might assume. I pay an annual income tax of > about 23%. How comes this number is that low? Tax revenue in France account for about 48% of the country's GDP[1]. I'm living in Belgium, and my payroll tax is already higher than these 23%. -- [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_tax_reven...

Income tax, however, doesn't cover social security. That's covered by the taxes an employer pays, and those are larger than 23% (but also contain other taxes). It's all detailed on pay slips. https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bulletin_de_salaire

Re: I had a health crisis in France

#40

Post by ekianjo »

angry-hacker wrote: post #13

Does France really have that low tax rate? Usually it's not only income tax people are paying over here and once Americans laern the total % of your money regular Joe pays for the government they are in shock, since they are not used to having so little money being left on the table.

> Does France really have that low tax rate

No, its much higher than 23% as claimed by the author. At least in the 30 or 40% depends on your level of income. Its also fair to say that there is a large amount of households in France that pay no taxes at all.

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