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Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

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Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#101

Post by badlucklottery »

micaksica wrote: post #25
panic wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, the nature of Twitter makes debate unlikely to end in agreement. Twitter is just trying to improve the environment for its users so more people will join and stick around. Most people find the "ideas that powered the NSDAP" quite disgusting.

> Most people find the "ideas that powered the NSDAP" quite disgusting. If we are truly building a society of tolerance, whether or not one has a visceral reaction to an idea should not stop whether or not one can discuss and debate it. I'm not a neo-Nazi, but I've talked at length with them about their views. I will give anyone a few minutes to explain what they are about, try to listen to it neutrally, and form my…

Sounds like you're talking about the paradox of tolerance:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance

Twitter has to choose between upholding the ideal of tolerance (4Chan is a good example of this) and trying to create a community of tolerance by running off the intolerant crowd.

I don't think there's a happy medium in this case because the alt-right seem to really like disrupting conversations that are inconvenient to them (instead of just tuning them out) and Twitter's short-form messages make that extremely easy because the conversations are so disjointed and often misinterpreted to begin with.

Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#102

Post by iopq »

micaksica wrote: post #44
nostromo wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't see "alt-right" as being so similar to "far-right" based on my limited exposure. I've watched some debates with Milo as well as Gavin Mcinnes. They are definitely not what most Americans would call "far-right" -- in that they aren't anti-gay, aren't anti-drugs, aren't socially conservative, and aren't particularly hawkish. They seem to dislike Republicans like Paul Ryan almost as much as Nancy Pelosi. Milo re…

I can hardly call myself an expert on the "alt right" either, but the difference is in use of term. When leftists think "Right wing" in the US think of the Christian theocracy. However, conservatism is only one sect of the right. The right is also reactionary, and the alt-right is definitely reactionary. I'd argue the alt-right fits nicely into Wikipedia's definition of far-right politics [1]. [1] https://en.wikipedi…

That's why it's "alt-right" - because the politics of the alt-right stem from a different source than the far-right theocratic conservatism.

The alt-right are younger neo-reactionaries who are tired of political correctness, tired of the media narrative.

Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#104

Post by stale2002 »

pekk wrote: post #92
hnsucks2 wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are the banned "alt-right" commentators commensurate with ISIS propagandists? If so, how much else ought to be banned? Black power groups? Anti-fascist groups? Many "social justice" accounts post anti-white, anti-male messages with impunity. Should we then paint all people concerned with social justice with the same brush?

Were the literal 1930s Nazis comparable to ISIS propagandists? If not, then why not? What about modern Neo-Nazis, are they really better? Why?

The people that the left calls neo nazis would likely reject that label.

Just because you call a group you don't like a Nazi, doesn't make it true.

Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#105

Post by icanhackit »

grzm wrote: post #57
icanhackit wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the media is kind of empowering the "alt-right" by constantly referring to them as the "alt-right". It presents it as the little guy vs The Man, and I think that makes it much more palatable than "far right." Great observation and you hint at a simple solution - call them by their conventional moniker: the far-right. There's nothing new about their ideologies and "the far-right" elicit a different response from peopl…

Maybe, and in some cases you're likely right. In others, might it not be people who consider themselves right (and not extreme) but no longer feel the Republicans (the traditional right) truly represent them? As an aside, there are likely plenty of people on the left that feel similarly.

might it not be people who consider themselves right (and not extreme) but no longer feel the Republicans (the traditional right) truly represent them?

The far-left/left/center-left etc and right side counterparts are defined by policy and ideology, so whether they feel the GOP was in touch doesn't really make a difference.

You wouldn't call the Republicans "right" if they started handing out generous welfare packages to the masses.

Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#106

Post by micaksica »

badlucklottery wrote: post #101
micaksica wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Most people find the "ideas that powered the NSDAP" quite disgusting. If we are truly building a society of tolerance, whether or not one has a visceral reaction to an idea should not stop whether or not one can discuss and debate it. I'm not a neo-Nazi, but I've talked at length with them about their views. I will give anyone a few minutes to explain what they are about, try to listen to it neutrally, and form my…

Sounds like you're talking about the paradox of tolerance: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance Twitter has to choose between upholding the ideal of tolerance (4Chan is a good example of this) and trying to create a community of tolerance by running off the intolerant crowd. I don't think there's a happy medium in this case because the alt-right seem to really like disrupting conversations that are inco…

Thank you for the link. I didn't know there was a formal name for this.

> the alt-right seem to really like disrupting conversations that are inconvenient to them

That's aggressive behavior, then. I'm defending the alt-right's ability to use Twitter for expression and talk with themselves, and with people that have shown interest in their ideas. If they're off brigading every source they disagree with all the time with harassment and memes, that's a different issue, and Twitter should be wielding the banhammer in an egalitarian fashion on all groups behaving this way (per the views they hold themselves to.)

Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#107

Post by daxorid »

nostromo wrote: post #32
micaksica wrote: post #8

I'm not a fan of the "alt-right" or a lot of its subculture. I also don't find it particularly "alt", as much as it is "far" right. It is a lot of the ideas that powered the NSDAP enveloped in the language of the Internet and memes, with the targets broadened from Jewry to non-whites in general. However, I'm also not a fan of suspending these accounts for controversial views if they are not harassing people on the Tw…

I don't see "alt-right" as being so similar to "far-right" based on my limited exposure. I've watched some debates with Milo as well as Gavin Mcinnes. They are definitely not what most Americans would call "far-right" -- in that they aren't anti-gay, aren't anti-drugs, aren't socially conservative, and aren't particularly hawkish. They seem to dislike Republicans like Paul Ryan almost as much as Nancy Pelosi. Milo re…

Let me correct you. I am strongly alt-right. Milo and Gavin are definitely NOT ideological compatriots.

Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#108

Post by htns »

waterphone wrote: post #78
jgrowl wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was thinking about this earlier. It's so silly. Neo Conservative was already taken so lets make up a new term to label people with. "I know, how about alt-right..."

Alt-right people came up with the name for themselves, it wasn't a term others created to label them.

Either way it's a navel-gazing orwellism.

Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#109

Post by qadevleadgrunt »

MichaelBurge wrote: post #29

Twitter doesn't turn a profit, do they? If they get a couple months of losing users, that could easily pop their inflated stock. I'm not sure this is a good move for them.

Personally I have stopped using Twitter all together - along with Facebook news; as both channels are dominated by people that are into racist and misogynist behavior - all in order to spread their hate speech. Something I simply do not subscribe to.

If they don't curb the hate speech and racism they are even closer to being cut entirely out of my life - I would think this is what they as a company has to balance vs people that are into those things and appreciate having a platform for such behavior. As of right now - I personally - would never work for a Twitter/Facebook, due to the online presences that they actively support, albeit I'm sure that talent pool is not #1 priority.

It's definitely not an easy position, and I guess it kinda shows that touting yourself as a tech company when you are really a platform for good/bad/medium ideas comes with its own set of challenges.

Re: Twitter Suspends Prominent Alt-Right Accounts

#110

Post by grad_ml »

iopq wrote: post #82
commenting wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Black Lives Matter means Black Lives Matter as well . The All Lives Matter movement, as a reaction to BLM, is essentially saying that they don't, and that the racial struggles of American Blacks are irrelevant. That is the reason why All Lives Matter is considered abusive.

> The All Lives Matter movement, as a reaction to BLM, is essentially saying that they don't That's not what "all" means. It's turning the name of the movement by implying it means "only" Black Lives Matter. So All Lives Matter is saying that not only Black Lives Matter.

The question is why people of color have to come up with "BLM" movement. Why not Latinos, White or some other racial entity (not yet, because they are not demographically significant)? Because there had been numerous instances, when black folks have been murdered by police brutally without any repercussions from courts or government. So, this is not the time for all lives matter, yet.
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