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“I have toyota corola”

daniel.haxx.se

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Re: “I have toyota corola”

#331

Post by [deleted] »

chc wrote: post #222
drzaiusapelord wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's this bizarre thing going on on HN, reddit, and other tech sites. We saw it with Linus and we see it again with Trump. Suddenly, all these people are making excuses for terrible behaviors and outrageous claims. Usually following a "he didn't really mean that" playbook of justifications like "productivity" or "politics" like either excuses acting like a child. Why are we afraid to call people out on the shit th…

Has Linus Torvalds ever said anything offensive to you or anyone you know? It seems to me that the people complaining about his behavior basically don't have the standing to do so — they're attempting to police other people's interactions that didn't involve them. (This is different from Donald Trump, where people have actually complained about being wronged by him, rather than complaining about an interaction betwee…

[deleted]

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#332

Post by jfroma »

elFarto wrote: post #120
freehunter wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I get something similar. I was an early adopter of a popular email service, so I managed to get @ .com. Pretty neat, pretty simple, right? Except I have a really common name, and people seem think that if the email address has their name in it, it must be their email address. I get sign-ups for Facebook all the time. I get emails about credit scores that make me panic until I realize I didn't sign up for that service…

I'm amazed how many people get their email address wrong. I have . @gmail.com, which is fine, and hardly gets any mail meant for someone else. @gmail.com however, is basically unusable. Funny thing is, the latter was the one I created first, but I forgot the password so had to create the other. I managed to recover it later and I'm glad I have the former.

I have a , my lastname is very uncommon but it turns out that someone in another country has the same first name and last name and you can get my email by googling my name. So, I have received few emails for him and kindly replied that I wasn't him.

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#333

Post by joe563323 »

paxcoder wrote: post #180
drzaiusapelord wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Knuth is such a class act. I don't think I've ever heard a negative story about him. Contrast him to, say, the harsh laguage Linus Torvalds routinely engages in or the many stories pointing out Steve Jobs' unfriendly side. I'm not 100% sure if you have to be a jerk to get ahead in life and lean towards 'yes' on this but when I see guys like Knuth, I wonder if nice guys do win sometimes. >TXT2COM As an 80s BBS kid, I…

Logged in to upvote your comment, hopefully you won't be disuaded by downvotes. Maybe this whole "deal with my being unpleasant" thing stems from people seeking to justify their unwilingness or inability to practice self-control. Whatever the reason it is detrimental and worthy of being opposed to. It's one thing to be unpleasant to people who are obstinate. It's another to be unpleasant to people who are ignorant. A…

May be Linus has to deal with lots of team members. Knuth works in solitude.

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#334

Post by tremon »

peterwwillis wrote: post #238
chc wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Policing other people's interactions without the consent of any involved party is pure paternalism. What you think is shit being flung might be Tootsie Rolls to them, and it is not our place to tell these people how they have to feel.

Consent is irrellevant. We have a society specifically to police each other. And because we suck at both policing each other and achieving consensus and cooperation, we have government. In terms of profanity, if someone says "man, I had a really shitty day today", that's not really harmful and doesn't have significant consequences. But when someone says "you are a real piece of shit", that is harmful, and does have c…

We have a society specifically to police each other

Err, no we don't. We have a society specifically to co-exist with each other. Proactively policing each other actually reduces our ability to co-exist.

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#335

Post by tremon »

haneefmubarak wrote: post #256
pbhjpbhj wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>and our support number included an option users could select // Did you charge callers. I wonder if "you will be billed £20 for this call [or $30 or whatever]; current customers will have this cost refunded" would be enough (even if you never charged) to put people off.

Not the parent, but that actually seems like a pretty solid idea. Is this actually something that can be done? Alternatively, why not just require the customer to enter their 10+ digit account number to proceed further?

It is what Microsoft does. Even with a support contract, you have to provide them with a credit card number before they will accept a support case. When Microsoft agrees you've found a genuine bug in their software, they won't charge you.

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#336

Post by icantdrive55 »

beachy wrote: post #262
drzaiusapelord wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's this bizarre thing going on on HN, reddit, and other tech sites. We saw it with Linus and we see it again with Trump. Suddenly, all these people are making excuses for terrible behaviors and outrageous claims. Usually following a "he didn't really mean that" playbook of justifications like "productivity" or "politics" like either excuses acting like a child. Why are we afraid to call people out on the shit th…

If you want to join the marines, you'll be screamed at, verbally abused, and generally pushed to your limits. It has to be that way, they are training 18 year olds to run to the sound of gunfire and perform under fire and the threat of death. You must put up with it or you do not belong in that group. At the other extreme, if you want to join your local flying club, you can expect to be treated courteously. If anyone…

"you want to join the marines, you'll be screamed at, verbally abused, and generally pushed to your limits. It has to be that way, they are training 18 year olds to run to the sound of gunfire and perform under fire and the threat of death. You must put up with it or you do not belong in that group."

Yea, they break down guys. And yes--we have trained soldiers this way forever.

I sometimes think they should do it slightly differently. It's basically negative reinforcement? I don't know of any animal that responds well to negative reinforcement.

Wouldn't you want a thinking soldier?

I honestly don't know, but have had friends go through bootcamp, and most are ambivalent over the training.

I don't want to argue. We haven't won too many wars lately. And I don't want to go back to WW2. It was a different time. Our enemies were different. I asked my grandfather about his experience during bootcamp after he enlisted in WW2. He said it was short, and to the point. "Just kill the Germans." He said a lot of guys were shipped over there with very little bootcamp. That war was our last big win?

I'm all for training, but completely breaking down a soldier doesnt make sence in our modern military.

But, I've never been in war, so I'll dummy up.

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#337

Post by kalleboo »

hinkley wrote: post #203
ptaipale wrote: post #198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My idea of the stereotypical English Gentleman as a program manager is someone who uses nice language and still makes it perfectly clear, after you have thought about it a little, that he's telling you to fuck off idiot. Not someone who's not able to communicate.

We Americans are dense and don't always pick up on undertones of disappointment. Half of the program answered his questions as if they weren't loaded. It was painful to listen to after a year.

Here's an article which discusses some difficulty that British communication could be causing in diplomacy right now http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-37799805

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#338

Post by AsyncAwait »

panic wrote: post #320
AsyncAwait wrote: post #306

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This may be an unpopular opinion, but I WANT Linus to be "rude" to SENIOR devs who should know better, because it's better to be rude than to ship code that results in critical infrastructure getting pwned, or worse, somebody to die. I actually fear the day, when somebody more polite gets in and lets it known, (unintentionally, of course), that shitty, rookie code is now fine, that being lazy and not treating the tru…

It's not a binary choice between being rude or shipping bad code. You can reject patches and give feedback without being an asshole about it.

> You can reject patches and give feedback without being an asshole about it.

He does give feedback, if you take a look at LKML he's only "rude" to the repeating offenders, not those who make a one-time honest mistake, but rather to those who got too comfy to actually review the code they're sending to Linus as "reviewed".

I am not saying Linus is always right, but if you actually follow his reasoning, it makes a great amount of sense.

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#339

Post by tephra »

digi_owl wrote: post #264
sillysaurus3 wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://lkml.org/lkml/2012/12/23/75 For what it's worth, coworkers have pointed out to me how much of a bully Linus has been. I'm not sure it matters that the bullying wasn't directed at them. Bullying is still bullying. To put it another way, would you want your manager to speak to you how Linus spoke to Mauro? Even if it was deserved? Linus also doubles down and insists it's ok: http://arstechnica.com/information-t…

So the only example we can find is when a senior dev, that should rightfully know the rules of kernel development by heart, is pulling not just one but two rookie mistakes within a short time span? And we do not expect Torvalds to fly of the handle at that?

Sarah Sharp leaving the kernel community comes to mind (although Torvalds is not mentioned by name but more a perspective on the whole community).

http://sarah.thesharps.us/2015/10/05/closing-a-door/

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#340

Post by _mghw »

monkeyshelli wrote: post #326
ivraatiems wrote: post #228

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're conflating corporatespeak/not being direct with being rude. Compare these three statements: "There's a problem with the function you wrote. I need you to fix it tonight." "The function you wrote is non-optimal for our goals. Please reconsider and reevaluate when you get a chance." "You fucked up that function. Fix up your shit NOW." The first is "standard professionalspeak." It's clear, direct, gets th…

Someone living in Finland (Europe) I always would take the third comment over the first one. In the first one, someone passive-aggressively orders me to finish fixing my stuff today . What if the fix is complicated and takes a week? To me "fix up your shit NOW" is more open-ended, and if the fix takes me a week then that's perfectly fine.

Wouldn't be HN without someone taking something far too literally to the detriment of the original point.

How about if we modified the first comment to say "I need you to fix it ASAP"? I can't honestly believe that you'd much rather take someone shouting at you and making you feel bad about yourself, than a direct manager who ALSO speaks his mind, but can do so in a controlled, adult manner.

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