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Review: Touch Bar MacBook Pros give an expensive glimpse at the Mac’s future

arstechnica.com

21–30 of 76 posts

Re: Review: Touch Bar MacBook Pros give an expensive glimpse at the Mac’s future

#21
post #19

> I use 13-inch laptops almost exclusively these days Stopped reading the review at this point.

Why ? Most office workers for example only untether their laptops when going to meetings. They are every bit as "power user" as those who use a 15 inch laptop.

Re: Review: Touch Bar MacBook Pros give an expensive glimpse at the Mac’s future

#22

Many of us just want the 15" display preferring longer battery life and smaller size/weight to using a discrete GPU. I am at a university and the 15" rMBPs are popular with students as well as researchers. I currently have the 2015 rMBP 15". Thus, it is disappointing that there is not replacement for the version that uses only the integrated graphics. Also, the Intel 530 graphics of the 2016 rMBP 15" appears to be lo…

Do you have a cite on the 20% slower?

Re: Review: Touch Bar MacBook Pros give an expensive glimpse at the Mac’s future

#23
People bitch about dongles but if you think about it, who would make this progress if Apple doesn't?

Apple is probably the only consumer tech hardware company out there that can do this. I almost think it's their responsibility to push the boundary.

People make fun of the term "Courage" and I thought that was funny at first too. But the more I think about it the more I get what he's trying to say. Right now NO ONE other than Apple has the "courage" to make this decision. Do you think Dell would do it? Samsung? Only Apple has enough influence in the industry to be able to do something like this and NOT lose all their users. If Samsung got rid of all their ports, people would probably ditch them and buy a Lenovo or something. So Samsung cant' do it. Coming back to Apple, I'm an apple user and I have to buy it because it's just much better for me as a developer. And honestly speaking, I don't care about all these dongles arguments and "it's not for a pro" arguments. I'm not buying a device whose primary purpose is to stick in my USB cable. And pros don't complain about their tools.

Anyway Apple knows that if nobody makes this decision, laptops will just stay as some stagnant genre of devices that are only able to do things that people used to do in the 2000s.

In other words, if Apple didn't do this, I think the entire laptop category will just stagnate and be cannibalized by other platforms. See TV as an example.

Re: Review: Touch Bar MacBook Pros give an expensive glimpse at the Mac’s future

#24
post #19

> I use 13-inch laptops almost exclusively these days Stopped reading the review at this point.

Why ? Most office workers for example only untether their laptops when going to meetings. They are every bit as "power user" as those who use a 15 inch laptop.

Users that rarely use their laptop on the go do not have the same concerns as me.

Re: Review: Touch Bar MacBook Pros give an expensive glimpse at the Mac’s future

#25

People bitch about dongles but if you think about it, who would make this progress if Apple doesn't? Apple is probably the only consumer tech hardware company out there that can do this. I almost think it's their responsibility to push the boundary. People make fun of the term "Courage" and I thought that was funny at first too. But the more I think about it the more I get what he's trying to say. Right now NO ONE ot…

PC Laptop world is actually really competitive. Check out Razer, Alienware, Yoga line, and Microsoft Surface.

They're innovating like crazy. Touch screens, OLED displays, external GPUs, different form factors, VR capable performance, etc. And many of those laptops integrated Thunderbolt 3 a while ago.

Regrettably, Apple has us all locked into their ecosystem via software so it feels like they are the only ones innovating.

Re: Review: Touch Bar MacBook Pros give an expensive glimpse at the Mac’s future

#26

Many of us just want the 15" display preferring longer battery life and smaller size/weight to using a discrete GPU. I am at a university and the 15" rMBPs are popular with students as well as researchers. I currently have the 2015 rMBP 15". Thus, it is disappointing that there is not replacement for the version that uses only the integrated graphics. Also, the Intel 530 graphics of the 2016 rMBP 15" appears to be lo…

> I've looked online and it appears that the 530 is about 20% slower than the 2015 rMBP 15" iGPU.

This is probably due to the increased screen resolution. If you make the resolutions of both models the same I suspect it will be comparable or faster in benchmarks.

(2015 MBP default resolution of 2880×1800 vs new, 3360×2100)

Something similar happened with iPads came out with retina displays. Pushing lots of pixels consumes more performance.

Re: Review: Touch Bar MacBook Pros give an expensive glimpse at the Mac’s future

#27

People bitch about dongles but if you think about it, who would make this progress if Apple doesn't? Apple is probably the only consumer tech hardware company out there that can do this. I almost think it's their responsibility to push the boundary. People make fun of the term "Courage" and I thought that was funny at first too. But the more I think about it the more I get what he's trying to say. Right now NO ONE ot…

It's more baffling when "pros" who claim to have been loyal to Apple for decades but aghast at getting only USB-C, forgetting that Apple have done this before, way back in 1998:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legacy-free_PC

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IMac#Influence

And again with the removal of the CD drives and Ethernet ports. Does anybody really miss any of those things? I'm sure the loss of RS-232 ports and floppy drives caused some people pain during the transition, but the world moved on and it will move on again.

Re: Review: Touch Bar MacBook Pros give an expensive glimpse at the Mac’s future

#28

People bitch about dongles but if you think about it, who would make this progress if Apple doesn't? Apple is probably the only consumer tech hardware company out there that can do this. I almost think it's their responsibility to push the boundary. People make fun of the term "Courage" and I thought that was funny at first too. But the more I think about it the more I get what he's trying to say. Right now NO ONE ot…

It's more baffling when "pros" who claim to have been loyal to Apple for decades but aghast at getting only USB-C, forgetting that Apple have done this before, way back in 1998:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legacy-free_PC

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IMac#Influence

And many more times after, with the removal of the CD drives and Ethernet ports. Does anybody really miss any of those things?

Re: Review: Touch Bar MacBook Pros give an expensive glimpse at the Mac’s future

#29

People bitch about dongles but if you think about it, who would make this progress if Apple doesn't? Apple is probably the only consumer tech hardware company out there that can do this. I almost think it's their responsibility to push the boundary. People make fun of the term "Courage" and I thought that was funny at first too. But the more I think about it the more I get what he's trying to say. Right now NO ONE ot…

There was plenty of progress in the laptop market before Apple became the power-player that it is today. Did Apple play a part? Yes. Did many of the other companies that have since gone out of business, merged, or still exist today? Yes.

Personally, I don't think touch interfaces are progress - for laptops (or desktops). There are many reasons this is true, but the biggest one for me is that your finger obscures things on the display when you use it, and there is often very poor or no tactile feedback. The touchbar idea is not entirely new. I think HP or Dell had some laptops years ago that used touch slider interfaces to adjust screen brightness or volume. Adding a display to that touchbar doesn't help that much as your finger just obscures whatever you are touching. Knobs, switches, and dials are better suited for this kind of work - which is why people complain about shallow keystroke movement on keyboards. The less and less key movement there is, the closer you are to a touch display.

The only reason that Apple is pushing touch interfaces like that is so they can reduce the unit cost and (maybe) improve the water/ingress resistance. It's the same reason they are removing ports. And yes, removing external physical interfaces may improve things like water resistance - but they make it harder for humans to use.

Re: Review: Touch Bar MacBook Pros give an expensive glimpse at the Mac’s future

#30

People bitch about dongles but if you think about it, who would make this progress if Apple doesn't? Apple is probably the only consumer tech hardware company out there that can do this. I almost think it's their responsibility to push the boundary. People make fun of the term "Courage" and I thought that was funny at first too. But the more I think about it the more I get what he's trying to say. Right now NO ONE ot…

PC Laptop world is actually really competitive. Check out Razer, Alienware, Yoga line, and Microsoft Surface. They're innovating like crazy. Touch screens, OLED displays, external GPUs, different form factors, VR capable performance, etc. And many of those laptops integrated Thunderbolt 3 a while ago. Regrettably, Apple has us all locked into their ecosystem via software so it feels like they are the only ones innova…

Yeah I agree that they are competitive, that's why they can add stuff but can't remove. Adding is easy. Adding is always good, which means it's easy to make that decision, but removing requires "courage" (haha I just can't help it although I agree with the term)

For example, it would be an idiotic move for Microsoft Surface to remove USB cables and headphone jacks because as far as hardware is concerned they're an underdog.

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