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“I have toyota corola”

daniel.haxx.se

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Re: “I have toyota corola”

#171

Post by kevinh »

kislotnik wrote: post #162
cesarbs wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Being a leader does not justify being an asshole.

You don't tolerate them but want them to tolerate others. TBH, I'd be totally fine if Linus ranted over my code because that's the way he is and I don't believe in community that tries to isolate an individual because he/she doesn't have a popular mindset. Edit: typical -> popular

That goes both ways, though, right? There are people who are isolated in the community because of the actions of hyper-critical people. The presence of people like Torvalds is isolating to others.

I mean, sure, you may think that Torvalds provides more value than the people he isolates, but either way people are getting isolated.

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#172

Post by ghaff »

mst wrote: post #167
cmdrfred wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My mistake 32k was the first I'd used and I downloaded a great deal of shareware at that time. I didn't realise it was dead by then.

I started off with a 36k and then a 56k modem and remember shareware being significantly involved in my early uses of it (also napster). I think the problem is that, for us, we arrived in the age of shareware via said modems so that was normal to us ... and then those on here older than us started enough earlier that our entire experience was the tail end of theirs when it already "wasn't like it used to be" for them…

Shareware was originally very much part of BBS culture (or at least hobbyist PC culture) and was largely set against expensive retail box software that mostly let you, at best, try out limited demo versions.

As the Internet/Web and open source merged into the PC world from the Unix world--and it became easier to legitimately trial retail software--shareware largely morphed into just another category of retail software that was sold online.

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#173

Post by dpark »

pmelendez wrote: post #166
ldfdr wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're confusing being a jerk with communication styles and cultural differences. You'd never hire anyone from the American inner city, from parts of Scotland and Ireland, parts of New York, and similar. Some very nice people talk loudly, swear, and use politically incorrect language. This is part of the reason some URMs can't get ahead in US corporate culture. Yes, Linus does swear a lot, and uses aggressive languag…

>No, he is not a jerk. The reason Linux beat the BSDs is because Linus is a very nice guy. He created a community which, despite the harsh language, was very welcoming, and willing to mentor new people. The BSDs created elitist, closed-off communities, which were unwelcoming to newcomers. I would challenge that notion that using an aggressive and diminishing language doesn't imply being a jerk. Also keep in mind that…

You think Linux didn't have legal challenges? Where have you been since 2003?

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#174

Post by ghaff »

dpark wrote: post #173
pmelendez wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>No, he is not a jerk. The reason Linux beat the BSDs is because Linus is a very nice guy. He created a community which, despite the harsh language, was very welcoming, and willing to mentor new people. The BSDs created elitist, closed-off communities, which were unwelcoming to newcomers. I would challenge that notion that using an aggressive and diminishing language doesn't imply being a jerk. Also keep in mind that…

You think Linux didn't have legal challenges? Where have you been since 2003?

The legal challenges were at very different points in their lifetimes. It's at least arguable that the legal issues associated with AT&T and BSD kept it from becoming as mainstream as it might have. (As did the somewhat splintered community.)

Linux OTOH was already well-established before the SCO suits.

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#175

Post by DanBC »

freehunter wrote: post #76
riskable wrote: post #26

I have had a similar problem for about two decades now in regards to eCards (virtual greeting cards). I own youknowwhat.com and one of my email addresses is youknowwho@youknowwhat... Turns out that thousands of people every year think they are being super clever by putting my email address in the "From" field. So of course I get zillions of "receipts" for these eCards. "Sister, I hope you feel better soon" ...is the…

I get something similar. I was an early adopter of a popular email service, so I managed to get @ .com. Pretty neat, pretty simple, right? Except I have a really common name, and people seem think that if the email address has their name in it, it must be their email address. I get sign-ups for Facebook all the time. I get emails about credit scores that make me panic until I realize I didn't sign up for that service…

The English NHS has a similar problem.

firstname.lastname AT nhs dot net

Or firstname.lastnameNUMBER if there's more than one person with your name.

Since the NHS is one of the largest employers in the world you'll find things like john.doe58@

It sucks.

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#176

Post by dpark »

pmelendez wrote: post #165
dpark wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nowhere did willhslade say that it does. He said that comparing Knuth's style to Torvalds's isn't very enlightening because they are fundamentally engaged in different activities. Comparing Knuth to Torvalds and saying "look, you don't have to be an asshole to be a great leader" is like comparing Usain Bolt to Dean Karnazes and saying "look, you don't have to be really muscular to be a great sprinter." The comparison…

>The comparison is pointless because Karnazes isn't a sprinter just like Knuth isn't leading major software efforts. That makes sense, except that OP said "You don't have to be a jerk to get ahead in life", he didn't mentioned being a leader. The followed commenters brought the leadership point into attention and then subtly implied that there is more correlation between being a jerk and a leader.

I was replying to cesarbs, who literally said "Being a leader does not justify being an asshole."

Edit: And yes, the conversation pivoted to being a leader because that is a critical difference between Knuth and Torvalds which seems very relevant to this sort of comparison.

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#177

Post by rpcastagna »

pmelendez wrote: post #166
ldfdr wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're confusing being a jerk with communication styles and cultural differences. You'd never hire anyone from the American inner city, from parts of Scotland and Ireland, parts of New York, and similar. Some very nice people talk loudly, swear, and use politically incorrect language. This is part of the reason some URMs can't get ahead in US corporate culture. Yes, Linus does swear a lot, and uses aggressive languag…

>No, he is not a jerk. The reason Linux beat the BSDs is because Linus is a very nice guy. He created a community which, despite the harsh language, was very welcoming, and willing to mentor new people. The BSDs created elitist, closed-off communities, which were unwelcoming to newcomers. I would challenge that notion that using an aggressive and diminishing language doesn't imply being a jerk. Also keep in mind that…

> I would challenge that notion that using an aggressive and diminishing language doesn't imply being a jerk.

It's 100% a cultural difference. While you see it as personally aggressive and grating, a lot of people see "overly polite" language as a sign that you don't care about the topic being discussed and/or are trying to address an issue politically rather than by merits of a strong argument. Neither of these perceptions is really right or wrong, it just has to do with the perspective you have based on where you grew up and who you've interacted with the most.

From an engineering perspective it'd be optimal if everyone had the same universal expectations for how a conversation should be held, just like how it'd be optimal if everyone spoke the same language. People don't really work that way, though, and just like with languages we try to accommodate each other as much as possible and find middle grounds, etc.

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#178

Post by drzaiusapelord »

danaliv wrote: post #50

What on earth does a car need curl for?

Radio/infotainment devices in automobiles are the wild west of development. They're not tightly engineered software like firmware controllers. Its usually a shoddy linux distro with some window dressing and as you can imagine a bunch of scripts keeping it all together. I imagine curl is used to grab some information from the web like updates, weather, etc. Because the copyright must be displayed somewhere, I imagine enough button mashing gets you that notice with his email pretty quickly on the radio head-end, thus the emails.

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#179

Post by DanBC »

mrbill wrote: post #158

Along similar lines (someone grabbing on to an email address and blaming the recipient for their problems), from a few years back: the city of Tuttle, OK vs. CentOS http://www.theregister.co.uk/2006/03/24/tuttle_centos/ http://www.jaduncan.com/2006/03/centos-vs-city-of-tuttle.htm...

> I am computer literate! I have 22 years in computer systems engineering and operation.

good grief. that poor cent os person.

Re: “I have toyota corola”

#180

Post by paxcoder »

drzaiusapelord wrote: post #110
kpgraham wrote: post #90

Back in the days of shareware, around 1985, I wrote a program called TXT2COM. It was a simple way of turning a text file into an executable. All a user had to do was run the converted com file and the text file appeared on the screen with full scrolling, search and save. I had my name and phone number embedded in the program. My first problem was when someone converted the Constitution of the United States into a COM…

Knuth is such a class act. I don't think I've ever heard a negative story about him. Contrast him to, say, the harsh laguage Linus Torvalds routinely engages in or the many stories pointing out Steve Jobs' unfriendly side. I'm not 100% sure if you have to be a jerk to get ahead in life and lean towards 'yes' on this but when I see guys like Knuth, I wonder if nice guys do win sometimes. >TXT2COM As an 80s BBS kid, I…

Logged in to upvote your comment, hopefully you won't be disuaded by downvotes. Maybe this whole "deal with my being unpleasant" thing stems from people seeking to justify their unwilingness or inability to practice self-control. Whatever the reason it is detrimental and worthy of being opposed to. It's one thing to be unpleasant to people who are obstinate. It's another to be unpleasant to people who are ignorant. And yet another to be rude to people who you simply disagree with.
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