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India raises withdrawal limit as rupee anger mounts

bbc.com

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Re: India raises withdrawal limit as rupee anger mounts

#41

Post by zanny »

jetru wrote: post #23
orf wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Hardly impartial or rational. I mean where are the people cheering for Trump and their view points? In other highly impartial and irrational places, like breitbart, the_donald and other conservative media sources.

Fair enough :) I meant on television. I guess Fox News. And maybe I'm in the online echo chamber. It's really hard to tell.

Trumps facebook groups, twitter feeds, and the aforementioned subreddits around his campaign are non-stop pumping out Trump love.

The Internet is only as much of an echo chamber as you let it be. You can always go look in those alternative forums.

Re: India raises withdrawal limit as rupee anger mounts

#42

Post by swatkat »

kamaal wrote: post #28
nitinreddy88 wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do accept this fact. Is there better option? I am quite sure this decision was taken after discussing with lot of people who might have done PhDs in Economics and serving for Govt.

>>I do accept this fact. Is there better option? Which fact do you not accept? Do you believe every person in India has a bank account? Every person has credit cards? Debit cards? Do you believe purchasing chain from production to end consumers has infrastructure for electronic transactions? Or that there is a way to make the economy run when close to 80% of the money is taken out of circulation? >>I am quite sure th…

Well, due to Prime Minister's Jan Dhan Yojana scheme, a lot more people have bank accounts and debit cards now. Over 220 million bank accounts were opened since 2014. People who have those accounts can actually make use of them now.

Re: India raises withdrawal limit as rupee anger mounts

#43

Post by swatkat »

danparsonson wrote: post #39
essdas wrote: post #27

I think the BBC has completely missed the sentiment on the ground. There is widespread support for this. Every single person I've spoken to in the long queues near ATMs have expressed that they don't mind the inconvenience because it will help the country.

But then again, by definition those are not the people who are hurt the worst, because they have bank accounts.

You don't need a bank account to exchange demonetized currency notes.

Re: India raises withdrawal limit as rupee anger mounts

#44

Post by gnipgnip »

wav-part wrote: post #12

My initial gut reaction is/was, a costly political stunt to fullfill an election promise. But I will wait when we have figures about cost to economy vs additional tax revenue. It also should be taken into account that Rupee now is even more unlikely to become a global currency. Instead of money going directly to corrupt bureaucrats now it will directly going to politicians to be spent on unsustainable welfare (subsid…

+1

Taxation by a state which has very little legitimacy is more akin to thievery. This shows all the signs of a new Indira Gandhi-esque regime in the making (with about the same amount of fanfare).

- The currency replacement is likely going to take about ~$5B (the "Black money" is valued at $20B).

- Nothing stops Pak from counterfeiting these new notes.

- This move creates a reverse bank run to build up reserves, which in light of the rate (10-15% ?) of bad loans in Indian Banks, is interesting to say the least.

- There also appears to be a very big push under this regime to push for cashless-id transactions. With the UIDAI in place, pessimists would believe there to be the coming of an even more efficient 1984-esque system for producing more cheap labor for US & pals.

Re: India raises withdrawal limit as rupee anger mounts

#45

Post by kamaal »

swatkat wrote: post #42
kamaal wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>I do accept this fact. Is there better option? Which fact do you not accept? Do you believe every person in India has a bank account? Every person has credit cards? Debit cards? Do you believe purchasing chain from production to end consumers has infrastructure for electronic transactions? Or that there is a way to make the economy run when close to 80% of the money is taken out of circulation? >>I am quite sure th…

Well, due to Prime Minister's Jan Dhan Yojana scheme, a lot more people have bank accounts and debit cards now. Over 220 million bank accounts were opened since 2014. People who have those accounts can actually make use of them now.

A lot more != All, let alone that. A lot more != Everybody-in-the-purchase-chain.

Now it was a known fact that 80% of the currency will go out of rotation. Now regardless of whether you have an account, 80% of the money people use to trade is gone!

Doesn't help if you have a account either. You don't have money to buy stuff.

Your point is if(and that is a big 'if' given 80% is gone!) you have money you could deposit it. Not spend it.

Re: India raises withdrawal limit as rupee anger mounts

#46

Post by sufiyan »

nitinreddy88 wrote: post #5
rwbt wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That might be true, but your Indian colleagues are probably well off with much of their transactions happening in plastic/electronic anyways, so this will have very little effect on their day to day lives. Since much of the Indian economy is cash based, there is a lot of frustration in the working class and there is a serious cash (as in bank notes) crunch.

I do accept this fact. Is there better option? I am quite sure this decision was taken after discussing with lot of people who might have done PhDs in Economics and serving for Govt.

Nope. This decision seems to have happened at the whim of 3 people - the PM, the finance minister, the RBI governor. Clearly they didn't even proof read the notes. The back side of the 2k rupee notes is a mess. They screwed up the spelling of 2 in Hindi and 1000 in Urdu making it Bazaar from Hazaar

Re: India raises withdrawal limit as rupee anger mounts

#47

Post by sufiyan »

swatkat wrote: post #42
kamaal wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>I do accept this fact. Is there better option? Which fact do you not accept? Do you believe every person in India has a bank account? Every person has credit cards? Debit cards? Do you believe purchasing chain from production to end consumers has infrastructure for electronic transactions? Or that there is a way to make the economy run when close to 80% of the money is taken out of circulation? >>I am quite sure th…

Well, due to Prime Minister's Jan Dhan Yojana scheme, a lot more people have bank accounts and debit cards now. Over 220 million bank accounts were opened since 2014. People who have those accounts can actually make use of them now.

Actually the previous time that this was shared on HN, the article clearly pointed out that less than 25% of the accounts are actually active.

Re: India raises withdrawal limit as rupee anger mounts

#48

Post by ktta »

0xmohit wrote: post #16

I am amazed the amount of selfishness we exhibit. If I am unable to pick up groceries for the lack of cash, I can surely choose to order it online (using a credit/debt card). A vast majority of Indians cannot. A majority of Indians don't have access to banks either. They will be forced to exchange their now illegal currency with the help of agents who would charge them 50 to 60%. Most of the ATMs are out of cash. The…

I'm really curious as to where you learnt of that 6% statistic. Any links you can provide?

Re: India raises withdrawal limit as rupee anger mounts

#49

Post by swatkat »

kamaal wrote: post #45
swatkat wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, due to Prime Minister's Jan Dhan Yojana scheme, a lot more people have bank accounts and debit cards now. Over 220 million bank accounts were opened since 2014. People who have those accounts can actually make use of them now.

A lot more != All, let alone that. A lot more != Everybody-in-the-purchase-chain. Now it was a known fact that 80% of the currency will go out of rotation. Now regardless of whether you have an account, 80% of the money people use to trade is gone! Doesn't help if you have a account either. You don't have money to buy stuff. Your point is if(and that is a big 'if' given 80% is gone!) you have money you could deposit…

Well, I didn't actually say 'lot more == all'. I was just mentioning that PMJDY bank accounts and debit cards would ease things a bit for the people who have them, compared to the days when they had no bank accounts whatsoever (remember, PMJDY bank accounts are specially tailored for people with low income and/or unstructured income). Anyway, you don't need a bank account to exchange demonetized currency notes.

Re: India raises withdrawal limit as rupee anger mounts

#50

Post by swatkat »

sufiyan wrote: post #47
swatkat wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, due to Prime Minister's Jan Dhan Yojana scheme, a lot more people have bank accounts and debit cards now. Over 220 million bank accounts were opened since 2014. People who have those accounts can actually make use of them now.

Actually the previous time that this was shared on HN, the article clearly pointed out that less than 25% of the accounts are actually active.

Yes. Now, a lot of PMJDY bank accounts are seeing activity. This could be the case where people actually using their accounts, or could be the case where they are being misused to stash black money. In any case, GoI is looking into it[1].

[1] http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/news/politics-and-nation...

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