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China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

en.people.cn

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Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#151

Post by Gupie »

TheOtherHobbes wrote: post #110
andygates wrote: post #102

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The very high cost of fission has a lot to do with how nasty, awkward, long-lasting and expensive the fuel and waste are. We really won't know until we try building a power plant.

Fusion produces energetic neutrons, and energetic neutrons are a very good way to make things radioactive. So all the popular approaches create waste that is more radioactive than fission waste, and probably comparable in volume. The only up side is that the decay products have a shorter half life. So the waste will only be a problem for a century or so, instead of for millennia. This may be better than fission, but…

Don't you get a lot more energy for a given amount of radiation?

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#152

Post by motoboi »

kybernetikos wrote: post #84

I would love to see a huge effort towards fusion, on the same (or even greater) scale as the Manhattan project or the Apollo program. I had been disappointed in the way that fusion always seemed to be 30 years away no matter how many years went past, but I just assumed that that was because the science was hard and just the way it had to be. https://i.imgur.com/sjH5r.jpg https://www.21stcenturysciencetech.com/Article…

> Massively abundant, cheap, clean energy should be one of humanity's top priorities.

What about the big fusion reactor in the Sky? Shouldn't we go all in on solar? Why is so difficult to harness that source? Maybe the same obstacles make fusion so difficult to pursue.

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#153

Post by Cerium »

motoboi wrote: post #152
kybernetikos wrote: post #84

I would love to see a huge effort towards fusion, on the same (or even greater) scale as the Manhattan project or the Apollo program. I had been disappointed in the way that fusion always seemed to be 30 years away no matter how many years went past, but I just assumed that that was because the science was hard and just the way it had to be. https://i.imgur.com/sjH5r.jpg https://www.21stcenturysciencetech.com/Article…

> Massively abundant, cheap, clean energy should be one of humanity's top priorities. What about the big fusion reactor in the Sky? Shouldn't we go all in on solar? Why is so difficult to harness that source? Maybe the same obstacles make fusion so difficult to pursue.

Yes, we already have a clean fusion reactor with wireless power transfer to every location on earth (weaker signal at poles). All we need to invent is the wireless energy receiver!

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#154

Post by Crespyl »

hawski wrote: post #105
oelmekki wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Funny, the picture instantly reminded me of the Shinra and its reactors in Final Fantaisy VII :) [1] Regarding Mars, I would love someone who knows to tell us how this would compare to raw sun energy exploitation. Each time I think of solar energy, I can't help but think it's a waste to try to collect it under the atmosphere, given one of its useful properties is precisely to protect us from the sun. My thinking usua…

The biggest problem with setting a solar farm in space is efficient energy transfer [1]. Bezos proposes to build also industrial zones in space, but then the problem is raw material transfer [2]. The easiest thing to do is to reap what you can here on surface of the Earth. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space-based_solar_power [2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Space_manufacturing

Orbital solar is such a fantastic idea, until you realize that any kind of energy transfer at useful scales is almost by necessity going to be strategically equivalent to a BF laser beam. Needless to say, that's going to be a tricky subject in the current geopolitical climate.

I'm reminded of the book "The Mote in God's Eye", which featured an alien race using an enormous orbital laser array to launch an interstellar solar sail vehicle. The launch was pretty much the crowning achievement of the race, and also the pretty much the last one, as the launch laser was almost immediately turned back on the planet itself.

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#155

Post by finid »

Kadin wrote: post #59
finid wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A mouthpiece media of the CCP ! So if the NYT reports on the results of an amazing research from the JPL, you'll not believe it, right?

Uh, the situations are not analogous. People.cn is the website of the [People's Daily][1], which is a longstanding, official newspaper of the Chinese Communist Party. Not figuratively or in the sense of having a slant or something, but it's literally the Party's official newspaper. It's tempting to equate it to Voice of America, but even VoR is managed quite differently. There's not a direct equivalent in the US pres…

What you don't seem to realize is this: Depending on what they are reporting on, papers like the NYT, Reuters, etc, are quite literally official newspapers of the US govt.

And that applies not just to newspapers, but also to TV and radio stations.

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#156

Post by maxander »

TheSpiceIsLife wrote: post #48
maxander wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is quite possible that most of the new inventions will be coming from China, and also most of China's scientific production will be rubbish. China has been great with scaling up its scientific community, but the problem of establishing an academic culture of scientific honesty is harder.

I'm a bit confused by this comment. Are you implying that "an academic culture of scientific honesty" is something the non-Chinese world has but China doesn't? I'll concede it's probably a matter of degree.

Certainly, it's an issue throughout the West as well, to a degree. For that matter, my guess would be that the culture of honesty is improving in China while it worsens in, say, the U.S..

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#157

Post by Reason077 »

Cerium wrote: post #153
motoboi wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Massively abundant, cheap, clean energy should be one of humanity's top priorities. What about the big fusion reactor in the Sky? Shouldn't we go all in on solar? Why is so difficult to harness that source? Maybe the same obstacles make fusion so difficult to pursue.

Yes, we already have a clean fusion reactor with wireless power transfer to every location on earth (weaker signal at poles). All we need to invent is the wireless energy receiver!

The tilt and rotation of the earth also has a blocking effect, resulting in significant seasonal and daily variations in signal strength. Weather phenomena also effects it in many areas.

Still, the virtually unlimited energy available via this means is making it increasingly promising. Moving forward, storage technology will help overcome some of the limitations.

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#158

Post by AcerbicZero »

motoboi wrote: post #152
kybernetikos wrote: post #84

I would love to see a huge effort towards fusion, on the same (or even greater) scale as the Manhattan project or the Apollo program. I had been disappointed in the way that fusion always seemed to be 30 years away no matter how many years went past, but I just assumed that that was because the science was hard and just the way it had to be. https://i.imgur.com/sjH5r.jpg https://www.21stcenturysciencetech.com/Article…

> Massively abundant, cheap, clean energy should be one of humanity's top priorities. What about the big fusion reactor in the Sky? Shouldn't we go all in on solar? Why is so difficult to harness that source? Maybe the same obstacles make fusion so difficult to pursue.

Fusion power has a great deal more potential, whereas solar caps out fairly quickly based on distance from that big ball of fire in the sky.

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#159

Post by theandrewbailey »

Reason077 wrote: post #157
Cerium wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, we already have a clean fusion reactor with wireless power transfer to every location on earth (weaker signal at poles). All we need to invent is the wireless energy receiver!

The tilt and rotation of the earth also has a blocking effect, resulting in significant seasonal and daily variations in signal strength. Weather phenomena also effects it in many areas. Still, the virtually unlimited energy available via this means is making it increasingly promising. Moving forward, storage technology will help overcome some of the limitations.

Said variations cause significant motion in the fluid surrounding the receivers. Building alternative secondary receivers to extract this indirect energy can yield additional gains.

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#160

Post by valarauca1 »

Cerium wrote: post #153
motoboi wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Massively abundant, cheap, clean energy should be one of humanity's top priorities. What about the big fusion reactor in the Sky? Shouldn't we go all in on solar? Why is so difficult to harness that source? Maybe the same obstacles make fusion so difficult to pursue.

Yes, we already have a clean fusion reactor with wireless power transfer to every location on earth (weaker signal at poles). All we need to invent is the wireless energy receiver!

      All we need to invent is the wireless energy receiver!
We did, and we've already hit the quantum limit of how efficient they can be.

It isn't enough.

Well it is enough, but there isn't an efficient method to store or transmit the captured power. Solar is awesome, but the places it is most available also happens to be where it is least needed, in general, I'm aware of Saudi Arabia.

It should also be pointed out that Solar is the most [1] green house gas producing method of green energy. Wind, Nuclear, Hydro-Electric, and Tidal are all vastly more carbon efficient.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Life-cycle_greenhouse-gas_emis...

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