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China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

en.people.cn

61–70 of 235 posts

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#61
post #3

It's unfortunate that it's like this, but I automatically do not believe any scientific breakthroughs that come from China. There has simply been too much fraud for me to believe anything they say. http://www.sciencealert.com/80-of-the-data-in-chinese-clinic...

To be fair, fraud in Western research is prevalent as well.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-science-cancer-idUSBRE82R1...

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#62
post #47
post #6

For someone more knowledgeable about the state of fusion research: is this really a "breakthrough" or just another incremental step? It seems they only kept it stable for about twice as long as they did four year ago and that's not much of a breakthrough even if we did break the arbitrary one minute limit (or maybe its not arbitrary and becomes harder to keep stable approaching a minute for some reason?) At this poin…

It's an incremental step on a long road. To be sure, the ultimate goal is to understand how to control the plasma well enough to support indefinitely long pulses. But incremental improvements add up, or rather they compound like interest.

AFAIK, the goal is not necessarily indefinitely long pulses, but pulses long enough to allow for a net positive energy output. This is the reason why there is also pulsed laser research, etc. The bar is high, but we don't need perfection to make a lasting impact.

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#63
post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

True. We need to see China creating something that is not a copy first.

That's what they said about Japan in the 50s.

And the US in the early 1800s.

Schuyler Towne has an amazing discussion of this, how Europeans routinely were laughing at American inventions... until they suddenly very much weren't.

It's in this talk. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jqjacHSTd48&list=UUBDpLXSbLH...

I'd link directly to the relevant five minutes but it's hard to justify doing that sort of harm, depriving you of the other great 45 minutes there.

(Ok, let's say it's 34ish to 41ish. Still, that entire thing is probably better than the other way you were going to spend some 50 minute block today.)

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "nuclear waste is.. nuclear waste" bit is a thoughtless, easy jab that plays on the unfounded fear of nuclear energy. Safely stored nuclear waste isn't a danger to anybody. I also don't like how the rest of the video continues to try to put nuclear in a bad light, going as far as implying it's not "clean energy".

> Safely stored nuclear waste isn't a danger to anybody. You can not claim that without a credible plan to store it until it's no longer hot, however long that takes.

WIPP is designed to last over 10000 years.

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#65
post #3

It's unfortunate that it's like this, but I automatically do not believe any scientific breakthroughs that come from China. There has simply been too much fraud for me to believe anything they say. http://www.sciencealert.com/80-of-the-data-in-chinese-clinic...

There's significant differences between journals of medicine (and traditional chinese medicine) and journals of physics.

Just like there's a significant difference between psychology journals and physics journals.

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "nuclear waste is.. nuclear waste" bit is a thoughtless, easy jab that plays on the unfounded fear of nuclear energy. Safely stored nuclear waste isn't a danger to anybody. I also don't like how the rest of the video continues to try to put nuclear in a bad light, going as far as implying it's not "clean energy".

>implying it's not "clean energy". Well, it's not. Whether it's "cleaner" than alternative fossil fuels is an interesting debate, however.

Its byproducts, spent material, can be safely stored indefinitely in appropriate facilities. Running nuclear plants doesn't pollute the environment. How is it not clean?

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#67
post #3

It's unfortunate that it's like this, but I automatically do not believe any scientific breakthroughs that come from China. There has simply been too much fraud for me to believe anything they say. http://www.sciencealert.com/80-of-the-data-in-chinese-clinic...

Do you automatically disbelieve everything coming out of Europe, the United States, or any other country that carries out scientific research or has a regulatory framework for medicine? If you don't believe in the ability of China to run a life and death regulatory agency without systemic fraud, what is your reason for trusting their journalists? It took only a few minutes to track down the original source for this c…

I do.

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#68
post #59
post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A mouthpiece media of the CCP ! So if the NYT reports on the results of an amazing research from the JPL, you'll not believe it, right?

Uh, the situations are not analogous. People.cn is the website of the [People's Daily][1], which is a longstanding, official newspaper of the Chinese Communist Party. Not figuratively or in the sense of having a slant or something, but it's literally the Party's official newspaper. It's tempting to equate it to Voice of America, but even VoR is managed quite differently. There's not a direct equivalent in the US pres…

The US press has lost fair amount of credibility in this election cycle. Case in point, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eOCcRnvMPEU&feature=youtu.be

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#69
post #3

It's unfortunate that it's like this, but I automatically do not believe any scientific breakthroughs that come from China. There has simply been too much fraud for me to believe anything they say. http://www.sciencealert.com/80-of-the-data-in-chinese-clinic...

I wasn't aware of that. Their companies have the same problem with financial reporting when they're listed on U.S. exchanges. By default, you're supposed to be (extra) skeptical.

https://www.sec.gov/news/press/2011/2011-123.htm

Re: China’s ‘Artificial Sun’ achieves fusion breakthrough

#70

As per every fusion breakthrough I've read about ever: "Sure hope so! Not quite ready to short fossil fuels yet though."

But solar/wind is good reason to. I was amazed at how low the energy payment time for solar is - 0.5-1.5 years. With span of 20 - it gives 10 EROEI ... that is respectable. Not as oil in eras past (1 to 100) but in line with current 1 to 13
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