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Scouts and guides provide ‘mental health boost for life’

bbc.co.uk

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Re: Scouts and guides provide ‘mental health boost for life’

#21

Post by fsiefken »

Spearchucker wrote: post #5

I was a boy scout in the late '70s and early '80s. Loved it, and although I was too young to care at the time, my son will probably not join because religion. Yes, they have a "non-religious promise" now, but you're still subjected to it. I don't care for it, and my son will (like I did) get to choose for himself but (unlike me) without being forcibly subjected to the propaganda. All that said, scouting has changed s…

Funny, here in The Netherlands, my son recently joined as I also had fond memories growing up with the scouts. I don't remember anything really religious except building the make-shift christmas church with the animals and a renegade priest in the woods. I was actually disappointed that God was left out of the vow (I am catholic) with my son, perhaps I should have asked. I don't know where you live, but do you really think the in your opinion bad things, the frequency of socalled forced prograganda, outweigh the beneficial things like playing outdoors and hiking in nature? Regarding religous education, you can't choose if you don't know what 'religion' entails. You can't explain it to your child as you have an anti-religious stance (which I fully respect), so he will have to find out for himself anyhow later on if 'choice' if something you value (or not). FWIW, I consider religion a metanarrative and vocabulary for the existential dimension of life, like playing mystical Nordic LARP stories. The sooner a human learns to speak or aprreciate it (in whatever form) the better imho. A vow to the Akela and the troop, fine... it's a vow to community values not to some sort of demi-god or god. https://twitter.com/fsiefken/status/741687278796431360

Re: Scouts and guides provide ‘mental health boost for life’

#22

Post by tomgp »

Spearchucker wrote: post #5

I was a boy scout in the late '70s and early '80s. Loved it, and although I was too young to care at the time, my son will probably not join because religion. Yes, they have a "non-religious promise" now, but you're still subjected to it. I don't care for it, and my son will (like I did) get to choose for himself but (unlike me) without being forcibly subjected to the propaganda. All that said, scouting has changed s…

I'm in the UK, former Cub and later a Scout. My daughter has just joined the Brownies, her promise doesn't have anything about God in it but does include something about the Queen. I'd be much happier if it were the other way around; turns out my (small r) republicanism is stronger than my atheism.

Re: Scouts and guides provide ‘mental health boost for life’

#23

Post by mkrum »

Artoemius wrote: post #3

It might be one of the cases where correlation doesn't imply causation. For an objective study, we would need to assign children to groups randomly. Otherwise, we can miss various obscure selection effects. (For example, if children who are more likely to be scouts, are also likely to be from a particular socioeconomic background).

Not only from a socioeconomic point of view, but I would guess that having parents who are involved enough in a child's life to pay for, drive to, and participate in these types of activities is more likely to be a source of a "mental health boost"

Re: Scouts and guides provide ‘mental health boost for life’

#24

Post by ptero »

parennoob wrote: post #6
Artoemius wrote: post #3

It might be one of the cases where correlation doesn't imply causation. For an objective study, we would need to assign children to groups randomly. Otherwise, we can miss various obscure selection effects. (For example, if children who are more likely to be scouts, are also likely to be from a particular socioeconomic background).

This is almost certainly the case. Being a scout/guide strongly correlates with parental income in the US at least – I don't know how it is in the UK. But if that is true, the headline might as well be "Being rich provides a mental health boost for life".

At least in my area I do not have an impression that scout kids are from richer families than all school kids (which should be a pretty good reference point; a little lower maybe because some of the richer parents take their kids to private schools).

I do see scouts take lots of active outside trips which can help with mental balance. Doing white water rafting, being thrown overboard, fighting elements, being cold and wet, seeing occasional physical injuries and the beauty of the stars in a desert can put minor life disappointments into perspective for a long long time. My 2c.

Re: Scouts and guides provide ‘mental health boost for life’

#25

Post by mfukar »

toomanybeersies wrote: post #4

I was in scouts and cadets here in New Zealand when I was a teenager and continue to spend a fair amount of time in the outdoors (I also did Outward Bound when I was 16), and I can definitely relate to the researcher's findings. When you're 2 days walk from civilisation, it's pissing down with rain, and you're cold, wet, hungry, and tired, you get a different perspective on life and the "soft" challenges that you fac…

> if you fail to pay the bills, you aren't going to die.

I don't know where you live, but in certain places failing to pay your bills means you end up in the cold rain with nothing to eat.

Re: Scouts and guides provide ‘mental health boost for life’

#26

Post by elcct »

Artoemius wrote: post #3

It might be one of the cases where correlation doesn't imply causation. For an objective study, we would need to assign children to groups randomly. Otherwise, we can miss various obscure selection effects. (For example, if children who are more likely to be scouts, are also likely to be from a particular socioeconomic background).

This is so common nowadays. Looks like clicks are more important than meaningful information and it is sad that such journalism hits thought to be credible entities like BBC.

Re: Scouts and guides provide ‘mental health boost for life’

#27

Post by jjp »

Artoemius wrote: post #3

It might be one of the cases where correlation doesn't imply causation. For an objective study, we would need to assign children to groups randomly. Otherwise, we can miss various obscure selection effects. (For example, if children who are more likely to be scouts, are also likely to be from a particular socioeconomic background).

More details on the study from NewScientist [1]

They analysed data from a long-running study of almost 10,000 people across the UK who were born in November 1958. They found that 28 per cent of the study’s participants had been involved in the Scouts or Guides, and that these were 15 per cent less likely to suffer from anxiety or mood disorders at the age of 50 than their peers who didn’t join. Scouts or Guides were not more likely to come from families of any particular social status. However, people from poorer backgrounds do have a relatively higher likelihood of mental illness – but this effect seemed to be reduced or even removed in those who attended Scouts or Guides.

[1] https://www.newscientist.com/article/2112209-scouts-and-guid...

Submitter but not involved in the study

Re: Scouts and guides provide ‘mental health boost for life’

#28

Post by wayn3 »

mfukar wrote: post #25
toomanybeersies wrote: post #4

I was in scouts and cadets here in New Zealand when I was a teenager and continue to spend a fair amount of time in the outdoors (I also did Outward Bound when I was 16), and I can definitely relate to the researcher's findings. When you're 2 days walk from civilisation, it's pissing down with rain, and you're cold, wet, hungry, and tired, you get a different perspective on life and the "soft" challenges that you fac…

> if you fail to pay the bills, you aren't going to die. I don't know where you live, but in certain places failing to pay your bills means you end up in the cold rain with nothing to eat.

Not in europe.

Re: Scouts and guides provide ‘mental health boost for life’

#29

Post by throwaway049 »

Jaruzel wrote: post #2

This is a counterpoint article to this: https://www.gov.uk/government/news/government-introduces-nat... The NCS is being beefed up to become almost mandatory for young people. Whereas UK Scouting has quite rightly pointed out they they've been doing this for over 100 years already. I can first hand (and second hand via my daughter) validate that being an active Scout brings many benefits to the child, and helps shape…

I don't get the impression of 'almost mandatory' from the article, but I still prefer the scouts to anything the UK government is offering.

Re: Scouts and guides provide ‘mental health boost for life’

#30

Post by r1k »

wayn3 wrote: post #28
mfukar wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if you fail to pay the bills, you aren't going to die. I don't know where you live, but in certain places failing to pay your bills means you end up in the cold rain with nothing to eat.

Not in europe.

Well, that depends where in Europe.
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